Browse:(1) ALTARS (Volume 1, entries 2735–2778)
(1) ALTARS
Volume 1, entries 2735–2778. Source context: THE DOCTORS AT WORK: REPORTS FROM LAYMEN → SHRINES: ALTARS - CANDLES - SAINTS; NEW ORLEANS AREA. Entries listed under this heading in the source volume.
Entries
Entry 2735
(They burn the candles in New Orleans and along the coast here. [I am repeating informant's words.] Do they do it in any other part of the country?) [I had not yet visited New Orleans.] No sir, it's more - it's founded on de Catholic super- stition. De Catholic Church burns a [good] deal of candles. (Then you think this candle burning is confined more or less to the colored people, who are more or less under the influence of the Catholic Church?) Yes sir. It's teaching dem because of dere religious ideas to my mind. On the other hand, of course, dey go off away from de teaching [of the Catholic Church] certainly. We understand dat de candles represent something in the life of Christ possibly, and among the praying [true believers] they use [them] in that way entirely: But the more illiterate and superstitious class of people aroun' New Orleans an' along de coast - along de Gulf of Mexico - where Spanish descent and French descent are Catholic people, their religious ideas influence that class of colored people and sometimes white people. They believe in candles an' people - de hoodoos dey use dat superstitious idea. They have a candle that they have manufactured in all colors - yo' kin git dem in all colors and dey usually have 'em in a room. [He describes altar but recording bad. For infor- mant's other contribution to this subject, see No. 427, p.128.]
Entry 2736
(What kind of name did you say? Algiers is what kind of name?) [I had not yet been to Algiers.] Jest dat ole antique name - you understand what I mean, of being a Hoodoos town. You know what I mean. That's that [town] cross the river at New Orleans, you know - jest got that ole antique name there. (Well, those hoodoos, are they any good?) Oh, some people very good, yeah. Ah've did some wonderful work there in Algiers. I was with Helen, and Maud, Frances - the Seven Sisters they call 'em. Yeah, they's very good girls - they are very good inter- pretaters. They had a mental capacity - all those girls did, and [Someone? one of the girls] is one of the best card readers in the country. [I doubt the existence of the original Seven Sisters as seven individuals; but. the idea of them, like that of Dr. Buzzard, was widely known and copied. Even Seven Brothers were invented (see below), perhaps from the seventh son of the seventh son, and of course there had to be a Seven Sisters root (p.645).] (I see. Well, I suppose there are just as good outside? You get some people just as good away from there?) Oh sure. The town don't make the mental capacity of a man - either de State [Louisiana] don't make that. It's just an old wife's saying away back in old antiquity - saying Algiers - 'cause that's the first originator, understand me, of de hoodoo proposition. Yeah, years back prior to me and yours birth, yeah.
The informant discusses hoodoo work and Algiers reputation. The work, origin and practitioner accounts remain attributed, with editorial doubts preserved.
Entry 2737
(What have you heard about them, the Seven Sisters?) Well, ah heard dey wus awful brainful, but ah don't think so much of 'em mahself.
(Are they still alive?)
One of them.
(They seem to live a long time - those Seven Sisters?)
Yessuh. (Well, what do they say about them? Just give me a little account of the Seven Sisters. What have you heard about them?) Well, dey tells me dat de Seven Sisters kin read yore mind; dey kin do any kind of hoodooism dat kin be did. An' co'se, de Seven Sisters works most by prayers an' in terms of de Bible. There are things dat chew kin take yore Bible an' where dat de Seven Sisters couldn't give yo' a substantial answer about, even so myself. [Extract from later subsection, interview with Havana Man, New Orleans, La., No. 1564.]
Entry 2738
[Everything within quotations is from my original penciled notes made while listening to some material my transcriber failed to transcribe. Underlined words are the exact words of informant. "Long story but not worth transcribing in full - tie string on [something's - black hen's?] legs and told her to go out until find him...bring son to mother - the Seven Sisters out of [from or at] bridge in New Orleans [Algiers] - the one called Mary, the informant use to go out there when in New Orleans - use lots of cards - read your palm - tell for- tunes - they don't do much - they don't use so much - lots of time they tell you jis' go home and whatever you want will happen - put choo in a dark room an' let you stay in there." Memphis, Tenn., (966), 1561:11.]
Entry 2739
De Seven Sisters.
(Where are they?)
Some parts of So'th Ca'lina - ah don't know exactly. (She went there in this scrape she got into and the Judge couldn't convict her?) Couldn't convict her - an' dey had her in jail an' ever'thing.
Entry 2740
Well, now, dere's lota other things whut ah hear people talk about gamblin' han's. Ah hear a fellah say a time ago dat he went to de Seven Sisters in Virginia, but he said he went dere fo' a gamblin' han'. Well, he wus give a gamblin' han fo' - by, not de people he went tuh see. He went to see dem [Seven Sisters] but dey wasn't in at present, but he found some man dey call Mr. G. H. Smith. He called tuh be a confidence man, which an' evah he is. G. H. Smith & Company ~ de books Company'S name on dat. Spells his name lak dat - G. H. Smith & Company. Dis man gived him a piece of lodestone an' he gave him a piece of somepin dey call de five-fingers [grass]; but dis was to be found in de woods, dis five- fingers. It's like a flower grows - it grow in de shape of five fingers, jest lak dose five fingers [demonstrates]. Dey gave him a piece of dat, after gitting dis lodestone, an' den he told him dat he would give him some othah kind of mix- ture. Dat wus wrapped up in a cloth an' it looked lak dat wus graveyard dirt. An' he told him to put dis all in dis little bottle an' every mornin' he tole him tuh feed dis heah wit Hearts Cologne. Now, dis stuff - ah looked at de thing an' it eat up de stuff, dat Hearts Cologne jest lak yo' take water an' drink it. Now, yo' could po' some of dis bottle like dis morning an' fill dat bottle half full, an' twelve a'clock every bit of dat stuff be gone. Dat stuff - whut dey had in dat bottle wit dat five- finger - would suck it up. Now, dis man could go into a gambling hall - no one knows de truth if I would tell it - he could go into de gambling hall an' money - jest walk in an' hold de cards - pick up any cards - doesn't matter whut cards he pick up - he could pick up any card an' that card would get him through. Now he could sit there an' jes' beat de skin game.
Entry 2741
Go out there an' git that an' send that off, see.
(Get this graveyard dirt?)
Yes sir, git dat. Gits it outa de head part - de face, see, but chew have to know personally dat dose people - how dey buried. If dey buried on dere back, yo' see, an' yo' gits dat right out de face of co'se. Den yo sends that off - yo' sends it off to dose Seven Brothers in New York. Ah reckon yo' heard talk of dose Seven Brothers, an dey'll dress dat an' send it back to yo' an' de red flannel, see, an' put nine pins in dat an' dis Heart-Home Perfune - keep it perfumed [fed] wit it, helps yo' to do de work. [The mail-order firm sells ingredients only; you must make the bag - a hand.] It will give you luck an' keep yo' - it's jest lak de powders, too, it keeps yore enemies away from you an' yo' successful in business of any kind that chew wanta start.
Entry 2742
It's a gift - ah been doin' it all mah life. (This woman [an author] says that down there when a doctor of this type has any disciples or anybody he is teaching - when they are initiated - Do they have some sort of initiation ceremony? Or something like that?) Yeah, they have that shore. (Do you know anything about what they do?) Well, ah tell yo'. Now we have - ah have had a school right to here. People say they are gifted - they got a gift. Well, ah'll try 'em to see if dey kin see it - to see if they know anything. Well, if ah see the same thing they say they see, den ah know they have a gift. Well, den ah'll go on a'develop 'em. I'll even show 'em articles in de Bible to read to git dereself in dat position. [See my biblical comment p.361.] Yo' see, then after they study that and they know it fluently - and den ah write down to de Temple an' git a diploma an' give 'em, see. Den dey kin go about an' use de Temple's name.
(Where is this Temple by the way?)
St. John's Temple. That's what we call a great hoodoo place. You will find that when you go down there. You jest ask anybody and they say it's one of the largest places there of its kind.
(They teach there? Is it a church or what?)
Yeah, it's like a church and dey have a lot of understudies and they heal there. They do everything. An' people go dere. They have more white than they do colored. (Did you ever hear that in these initiations they have a altar and burn can- dles and that sort of thing?) Oh yes, I have the same thing. Ah have it now at mah place.
(Sort of an altar?)
Yeah, ah have a altar wit saints and candles and oils and different things.
(If I came around to see you, would you let me see them?)
Sure ah let chew see - sure. You come around and yo' kin see it any time. Ah'm dere every day but Sunday.
(Do you have a special room or something of that sort?)
I have a whole basement downstairs - whole basement wit all mah business in it. Ah have one at de church too. You kin come to mah church sometime and you will see how ah perform.
(Yes, where is your church?)
Things ah knows from mah own experience.
[He conveniently missed my question. I do not repeat it.]
(All right suppose you tell me one of those.)
Dey take your photograph and dey turn it upside down and take a pink light and burn it to it fer nine nights and nine days, and dat will worry your mind. Maybe dis woman or somepin dat love you - it would cause your mind to keep coming on her all de time. Yes, she can. Dis woman she takes his name and she write his name nine times, she write her name nine times across this. And then she takes a pink light and she turns this light on top of this piece of paper. When de drippings of dis candle covers this full name then he will be back. Well, you would take St. Anthony. You would take St. Anthony and you would take three lights which would be a green one, a black one and a yellow one, and you would burn this light every night and every morning until these lights burn down completely. That would relieve you or your mind.
(If someone was trying to harm me. Well, what do you do about St. Anthony?)
St. Anthony, dat's a saint. Why you take him and burn dese three lights to him and ask him to....
(Oh, you have a picture of him?)
Oh, yeah, a picture of dis saint. You take St. Peter. St. Peter is a saint that is used fo' all thieves. Yo' take a brass key and you put dis key in de Bible and then you call names. Any- body that lives in dis house and yo' suspicion that anyone in this house did dis crime. Yo' call dere name and de Bible will tell you. It will turn on de one dat stole these things when you call de name, de Bible will turn an' fall.
(Well, what do you do with that St. Peter?)
St. Peter is on a picture. You only stand him and light a light, jest a white candle, and then use dis big brass key which is de one dat gives yo' de secrets to thieves.
(I see - you put that in the Bible.)
Say they have a thing that they call guinea seeds - supposed to control and give you power. You take one of those seeds and chew it up fine and jest as you about to enter and start to talking to this party, you spit this three times in front of 'em and say to yourself what chew want them to do. And they claim that they have to do these things.
(That is used when you are going to get a job.)
Now dey claim fer frogs - in order to have someone that chew wanta trick - put frogs in 'em - you take a frog and you will boil him. After you boil him you take this water and they claim that nine drops of this water into your drinking Water will create frogs to be crawling inside of you.
(Is there any way to get those frogs out?)
The only way to get 'em out would be jest the same way as they got 'em in. Well, in other words, dey say they'd boil de water for you to drink, and well dey would boil more water for you to drink again and den de frogs would come back [out]. [For Doctor Sims, see No. 34, p.23, and Index.]
Entry 2743
Set it eleven 'clock at night and you dress the candles. You get seven candles fer that purpose and you dress them with a certain kind of perfume. But chew have to do these things on the new moon. Anything that's good has to be done on the new moon; the bad thing they do on the waste of the moon. But now, if you wanted a person to come back, you dress the candles and you set 'em at eleven 'clock at night so it work on the new moon. And then you have to set the candles to burn and pray. [Pray while candles are burning.] And burn the High John Conker Incense. An' you do that from about eleven to half-past eleven. And then sometimes you set and concentrate. You know, concentration means a whole lot. Set and concentrate - hold your thoughts on him and you say while you talking to the candles, "John - Mary Louise," what- ever the name is, "In the Name of God the Father, let you be upset and let chew have no rest or peace wherever you are." Then you read a prayer in the book and - but you keep it up and finally they can't stay away. They will have to come back.
(What do you mean by that book? Do you mean the Bible? Or do you mean?)
Or the Bible.
(Do you have to buy these candles specially or just any kind of candle?)
Oh, no, you have to buy them specially. Sometimes you kin git them already dressed. You git them in New York on Lennox Avenue. You gits them there and you kin git them from Lawrence. Dressed candles. (Have you ever heard of people having little altars and burning candles? On little altars like in a Catholic Church?) Yes, ah do that myself. (I am rather interested in that for a special reason. Can you tell me just how you do that?) Well, we have our altar and we have the holy oil because everything must be holy. And because it's a place, people coming and cursing and that, and some- times they'll fergit and so the place is full of evil and dirty. But everything must be clean. We have holy oils - we have holy candles and you light them. You have seven holy candles, large ones, but chew have 'em in the form of a cross.
(Will you tell me again about burning those candles?)
You know you have them in the form of a cross. You see, you have those little candles. If you don't have those candlesticks that have the form of a cross, why you can jest sit your candles in a row there in that cross, you see.
(Two rows crossed.)
No, see. That's one row of candles across, that's 1,2,3,4,5,6, and then you have some here. That's a cross, you see. Then you have seven small candles like they have on birthday cakes. You have those and you burn those too. And you have those little votive lights sitting around.
(Well, now where would you put those little candles?)
You set them right in front of the seven cross like.
(Well now, how do you make a cross out of those seven candles?)
Those seven little ones you don't have to make a cross of them. Jest let them burn there.
(That other cross, how many do you put in that one row?)
Well, you jest - it don't make any difference how many, jest so you have a cross. Make a cross, you see.
(Then you use those little candles.)
Yes, but chew must burn yore incense. We call it holy incense. And then you use holy water. Yo' sprinkle yore place down with holy water and bless your place - must pray and read the 23 Psalms. Course you read the 23rd Psalms when you git up in the morning and you face the east and you say - you read so many verses until you get to, "The Lord is my shepherd, I shall not want, he makes me to lie down in green pastures, he leads me to the side of still waters." Then when you say that, and after you turn your face to the east, then to the west, and then you say a couple of more verses. And then when you say those other two verses, turn to the north and say the other two, and when you finish with them, make the last verse to the south. And that will keep your place holy and blest in the form of the cross, you see. And use the 9lst Psalms, if you wanta read, you wanta read a person to be able to git the very best results, to keep out the evil, you read the 9lst Psalm - jest a few verses you want of it. And use the holy candles with holy oil - that keeps the evil out and you aIways be able to get a good message and good vibration. You work better. (Now, you go through this ceremony before you go into this special room. That the idea?) Yes, you do that.
(Before you go in to work for someone.)
Before you start to work. Now if you was goin' tuh have a meetin' heah, a spiritual meetin', you'd come in round about six 'clock and then you'd do all that, and have your place all set up. And then you would git on your knees and you would pray and you jest set your candles all there and you pray and burn the incense.] Burn the incense while you on your knees praying, asking God to bless you and send you in a good crowd and success and let no one be evil, and sprinkle around the holy water and then you set and you concentrate, and you set and you hold your thoughts on success and prosperity and draw the people to you. That's all you do.
(Now do you have meetings? How often do you have meetings?)
Ah have been having meetings three nights a week, but I haven't been very well and not doin' so much now. (I thought if you were going to have a meeting while I am here in Washington, my man and I would come around to be at one of the meetings.) Well, you might come down Sunday - think ah'll probably have a meeting Sunday night.
(Sunday night?)
Yes, 'cause ah'm in kind of a small place now. Ah used to have a big place but ah'm jest having it in my house in mah rooms.
(Well, what time does the meeting begin as a rule?)
Round about nine 'clock. People don't git out until that time. (If a person wanted to get into this work, must he be initiated into it or what.) You would have to be born psychic and after you born psychic why then as you grow older it comes to you but then you have to have some one to instruct you, teach you.
(Then there is no form of initiation or anything of that sort?)
Then after a meeting, after you accepted in a class, course there's certain kind of instruction telling you what to do, and if you say you seen anything - sometimes you see things and don't know 'em. But they will tell you, explain to you. Then you get so - you get so then that you kin jest talk - jest open your mouth and the words will come right out. Then sometimes you see things - you see symbols, you see signs and you see jest the words. You get the words mostly in this ear sometimes [demonstrates] and you walk along.
(Your right ear?)
No, the left ear. This is the left ear. You kin hear it in the left ear, but you have to be born psychic. You were born psychic yourself.
(I'm born psychic? I suppose I am. Never have been sceptical about it.)
[We are talking about different things - see comment later.]
(About the people who are called Holy Rollers or the First Dominical Penta- costal Church. Do you think they have a spiritual gift?) Well, ah think they have a spiritual gift, but ah think that they don't quite understand the Bible. Now for instance, this Holy Roller, ah don't know anything about that, but this - what did you say the word there, The Holy Sanctified?
(This is something different from The Holy Sanctified.)
Well, ah think The Holy Sanctified has a gift of tongues - course it's in the Bible [1 Cor.12, and 14]. You see, if you pray enough and live close to God, the spirit will git on you so will talk in tongues. Your mouth will jest thuth, thuth, till the spirit got on yuh. But as far as being sanctified, ah don't think anybody is really all sanctified. Cause when you sanctified, ah think God takes you away from here when you get so holy. (If a person thinks he's hurt or anything of that sort, could you give him help in any way? Tell him anything about it?) Yes, if they was hurt and the spirit would show it tuh me, and I would see it and tell them about it.
(Then you could describe how they were hurt or something of that sort?)
If I see so. Most generally I see jest how it's done.
(Would you prescribe any remedy for them?)
Well, depends upon how they were hurt. Sometimes if people - lots of people comes to me and say that they are hurt and they are not. You know some people, the southern people, are very superstitious. And if they get a pain in their laig they think they are hoodooed or hurt. Not all the time it isn't that. If you don't tell 'em that, they'll go round and pay somebody else and give em the money. But lots of times they're not hurt. Sometimes people do's has things in them, but I have nevah seen anybody yet that had anything in 'em. Cause when I was a child somebody said that a person had something in them, but I don't - any that talk - I never seen any of it.
(Weren't you born in the south?)
Ah was born right in Washington, but ah lived in New York quite a while. (Well now suppose a person has this pain in his leg, what would you advise ordinarily?) Well, ah would give 'em a treatment with mah hands and pray over him. Or if I wanted, if the place was swollen I would get some herbs and mix a solution and bath it down. See. (But you don't believe that there is any spell? I mean, you don't think that he is hoodooed or anything of the sort?) Ah don't know really. They tell me they kin do it, but ah don't know. Ah never heard or seen. [My comment about being psychic merely means being aware and having a sense of direction (see Introduction). What little I have of this came from training; it was not a gift.]
Entry 2744
You've gotta know something about de Bible to do it. Comes from de devil, let it go on back [to him]. I would nevah try to do nothing to people and I wouldn't, and ah don't put no spells. De people come and dey says, "Well, could you put dis back." It don't work. Long as I git you well and work for yo' happiness, then it's all that's necessary. (Well, what sort of cure do you use? If I came to you and - had a spell put on me, what sort of a cure would you use?) Well, de first thing ah'd do - I heals, too. That's the next thing. The first thing I heals and then I use salt. Salt is used fer a thousand things that is good and bad. I puts this salt on a plate, saucer, then the party that's sick, I let them make a hole in dis salt wit de big finger [demonstrates].
(Of the left hand.)
Any hand but jest only dis finger - not de index finger, the middle finger. And then I repeats certain words from de Bible and let dem repeat after me and tell em - oh, yes, ah pour alcohol in it and let it burn, and de word dat dis light goes out on, it [sickness] stops right there. Then they must sleep over dis salt overnight. Then take it to the deep rivah and throw dis salt in de rivah and let it go. That watah running and dis salt will take away your con- ditions. Course dere's nothing you kin do fer nobody if they don't believe nothing. If a person don't believe nothing - nothing doin'. Becus if dey comes tuh me and if ah'm even jest goin'tuh heal dem ordinarily, ah says, If you don't be- lieve in God and you don't believe ah kin, ah don't wanta bother with you - no use using de energy:"' And then I always repeat certain words over a person when ah'm healin 'em.
(Are those words a secret? Or something you wouldn't want to tell me?)
"May it please thee, O Jehoges, to prosper" - I mean, "May it be thou most holy will, O El Mejah to heal de body and soul of dis person." You gotta call de mother's name and de person that you are healin'. "May it be thou most holy will, O El Mejah, to heal de body and soul of John or Susan, free 'em from plague and oppression."
(What were those words that you read out of the Bible? Were those secret?)
No, dat wouldn't be secret. It would be secret to people dat come to see me but not secret to persons dat knows - you know what I mean, if you understand. It's the loth Psalm of the Book of Moses. [We must remember here as well as everywhere in hoodoo, the Sixth and Seventh Books of Moses - probably in a number of versions and under various names - is considered by believers to be a part of the Bible.] Dis one dat keeps running in mah mind is de Psalm dat you read three times befo' sunrise. Dat's de 4th Psalm. That is in order to accomplish things that you desire. There's a certain name, a certain spirit, that you call upon.
(Is this Psalm in the Bible or in the Book of Moses?)
Both - but de meanings is in de Book of Moses - Sixth and Seventh Book of Moses. The 10th Psalm - well dat Psalm whut you use fo' healing and removing conditions from a person.
(Do you use any other book in addition to Sixth and Seventh Book of Moses?)
You kin take and look in de Sixth and Seventh Book of Moses and find out whut to read, and den you go in yo' Bible and read it from yo' Bible. You go to the fo' corners Of the earth and you take nine new keys and you call the spirit of this person - nine keys and walk to the four corners and you call the spirit. Yo' go dere at midnight and you call de spirit of de person whut you Want and this person will come. You worry 'em - de spirit [identified later] will worry 'em. Yo' send out yore thoughts through dese new keys and that brings the person back that you desire to.
(You mean the spirit of the dead person back?)
[This also brings the spirit of a living person.]
Yes, because you are sending out a self-conscious mind and yo' sending out the Spirit forces to bring this one back what chew want.
(Why do you bring this person's spirit back?)
Why do you do it? Well, because you wanta see this person that's away. When you making charms you use sugar with Adam-and-Eve, tea, coffee and sugar, 'cause everybody likes sugar in dey coffee or sugar in dey tea, and you mix that three together in your charm. That's the onliest way ah knows.
(What is the charm for?)
The charm is fo' those things ah told you about while ago, but chew gotta put Adam-and-Eve in it. If Adam-and-Eve is in, it holds the two together close, the man and wife, or sweetheart and friend.
Entry 2745
To bring in trade or any kind of congregation, you get what they call the Adam-and-Eve root, place that in the front of your door. Then you go to work and get what they call Louisiana hoodoo dust and put that under yore doorsill. Then you go to work and git what they call the good and evil candle and place that at twelve 'clock in the night in your front door with your door closed and burn it. And with the Eqyptian incense and by reading the 37th division of the Psalms of David, reads as follows, "Fret not yourself because of evildoers, be thou not envious in the works of iniquity and so forth. Why each night if you do that three times a week, you will have trade for thirty days.
(What do you do with this incense?)
Burn it.
(While you are reading the Bible?)
Yes, jest light it - light it iest befo' you start de reading.
(Where do you get this Louisiana dust?)
Wal, yo' kin write to - ah don't know her address - Louisiana - New Orleans, Louisiana.
(And she will send you this dust.)
I know fer mahself from an experience in 1923.
(Where was this experience?)
Heah in Washington, right heah. My first wife, we were living at 217 "E" Street, N. W., Washington, and she said to me on a Saturday - she had been invited out fo' dinnah next do'. She wanted me to go there with her an' I refused. Any- way she went. Sunday - that Sunday - [she] came back home [Saturday] - that Sun- day night she got in bed. On Monday morning between 9:30 and 10 'clock I had to rush her to Garfield's Hospital. And with them taking her to the hospital on that Monday morning, of having several specialists to examine her, to give her a thorough examination from time to time, and each one of them said that her body showed as though it was normal from start to finish. Well, her mother said that it was a spell. Later on, the one that she had taken dinner with begin to talk and tell other people about what she had done. And she said this, that she'd taken the skin of a frog and put it in a pan and cooks it real crisp and powders it up and give it to her in coffee and that was the cause of her sickness and also her death. Dr. Fowler, being at the time the head surgeon of the doctorical staff of the District, he give a thorol examination and said that he couldn't locate or tell what her disease was - even up to her death. I noticed on the night - on Saturday night - like she died Sunday morning, I was there at the hospital all that night. I notice between the skin and her flesh there were the figure of frogs. Her eyes begin to turn yellowish - de white of her eyes and her head. She suffered with very severe pains. After the doctors couldn't find out, even by taken a picture - they said her heart were perfect, her stomach perfect, her liver perfect, kidneys perfect - her whole system. But by the misery being in her head, dey couldn't figure or tell whether it might have been a form of an abscess somewhere on the tissue of the brain. So after her death they asked permission of holding an autopsy on her brain, and when they did that why they said that her brain were normal. Well, it goes on to show me that the fruits of the thing that which she [the other woman] had said that she had done was true. Later on ah begin to seek into such [the truth of hoodoo]. I goes to Alexanderia, Va., to a woman by de name of Cely Coles, and begin to seek information 'long dose lines. An' she says to me, she says, "It's true just what she said she done." That was itl But if you had obtained or had of went to work and taken some sulphur, table salt and alum and made a solution out of it, or made a little drink and give her nine tablespoons- ful, why she would have passed them from her and she would have gotten well.
[To remove 'live things conjured into the body, see pp.227-239 and Index.]
(After you found out these things, what happened after that?)
Well, ah came back. Wasn't anything that I could do then - jest to give it up in de hands of God. But I was glad to know these things. And then later from self experience - for mahself - ah had went to what we call a donkey party.
(What is that?)
That's jest the figure of a donkey made up into a picture of some kind and then you buy a whole lotta tails and then you take chances, see. And de one dat pin dose tails in the proper or nearest the proper place, they get the prize. Ah goes to dis donkey party - it was for the benefit of the St. Paul Baptist Church - an' while being there they were serving refreshments or selling refresh- ments and I bought some of them. An' after I had bought a glass of lemonade and drank it, I goes home and nine days from dat day I had hairy worms in my stomach. Now the cause of that was the oil out of the skin of a frog created those worms. A man ovah heah on tenth street at de time - I were carried to him and he give me medicine fo' that. Later on I found out jest what to do to prohibit those things. It matters not what a person might be hurt with, matters not what chew walk ovah, and if they come to be alive in you, you can take a silver dime or a silver dollar and take a fine file and file off part of it and boil it and take a tea- cupful of it. It will remove it one way or the other [above or below]. [See also, pp.484-493.] Not only that, we have a way to tell, there is a way to tell, even if you have just a weakness, whether you are hurt or not. And the way that is, is by taking a salt mackerel fish and bind it wheresomever that weakness is, with the head up and the tail down, and that misery will then become a terrific terror there. You will know then that it's no need of taking any medical doctor's [Doctor of Medi- cine's] treatment. You will have to seek other sources. Well, ah know at mah home town - Richmond, Virginia - there were an' ole lady by the name of Mary Moody lived on Green Street. That's in the east end.
(I've heard of her.) [Her name is somewhere in the text.]
Mary Moody. In other words there Was a woman lived in my neighborhood by the name of Lucy Williams. I leave Coatesville, Pa., an' I goes home and she becomes jealous or envious of me because I wouldn't go or keep company with none of her daughters. She goes to work, she did, an' taken one of those square halfa pint whiskey bottles used to be [before Prohibition] - Sherwood bottles. Comes to my father's house and my mother used to be fond of her, used to let her do all of her washing at times, and she'd taken a part of my underclothes, the seat of them, and a part of my left sock and carried it off with some different roots. Ah don't know what de roots was, but those different roots she packed in that bottle and she dressed it with still water - poured it in this bottle.
(What do you mean by still water?)
Water that she had let stand fer a certain length of time. And she dressed that nine days before she buried it, and when she buried it, she buried it in the pathway that leads from my mother's house to her well, that I might walk over it. An I become - begin to go over towards my left side and dwindling away to noth- ing without a ache or pain. An' mah father he'd taken me to Mary Moody. Mary Moody wanted her pichure and mah father happened to have one the pichures on a tintype in the home. An' he'd taken that and she said to him, says, "Now, you go back home and plow up your pathway from your house to your well and when you find this bottle," she said, "bring it to me." An' he did so. An' when he did that, why she'd taken it and drew that Lucy Williams pichure from de other one on a sheet and put this bottle behind it and shot it. She said, "Now, when yo' git back home, the same thing that yore son have on him, she will have on her and she cant git rid of it." An' that happened.
(What did she shoot this bottle with?)
With a pistol - a real pistol. (She drew this picture on a piece of paper and put it up before this bottle and shot through the paper and broke the bottle?) Yes.
(How long ago did that happen?)
That's been - that was in 1916. It's a man lives - he lives in Beaver Falls [Pa.] too - 606 Eighth Avenue. He don't keer if you give a policeman his address, he's iest that smart. He takes - he has five spools, spools what thread come off, takes three needles and run through 'em - that little hole in those spools.
(He puts the three needles right through the spools.)
If the street is coming this way in front of his house, he sets one object to that corner, one obiect at this corner, and one where you turn in off the street to go in de front of his door - with the one at each corner is pointing straight up and down the street.
(You mean this spool is pointing straight up and down the street.)
That's right. The one what enters the door pointing in an' out the door, and he has the two at the back the same way that the two at the first two corners are. An' he gits up and calls on de four winds - five waves of de water with the speech that he makes telling these people - it matters not who it is - to keep on passing his door. Dey would come round an' start to his door and their mind change and they walk right on away. Right today he has two stills turning out round about 90 gallons of whiskey each. (Now here's the street going by his house. On the corner of the street here and this corner of the street are the two spools - they are turned this way, the holes are turned this way [parallel to the street passing house]. Then you come to his house and the [third] spool is turned with the holes going this way - toward his house. And then where does he put - he puts these remaining two spools at his back door?) At the back corners of his house, yes. (And the holes in these spools are parallel with that of his house [the third spool]. He just passes these three needles through each of these holes. He doesn't do anything with the needles.) Man in Norfolk, Virginia, he was telling me one day, said that if you want a person to die, dat you take one of those cut nails.
(Those square nails?)
Square nails and take and carry it to a green tree on Sunday morning and you stump it [start the nail into the tree] and each morning for nine mornings go there and hit it, and you tap that together, and then the ninth morning, the ninth day you drive it up to the head. After that nine mornings, he said that person going crazy - drifting.
Entry 2746
Well, the trouble I had - first, the misery started in the thigh, the left, and this moved around to the right; then, something came on up and stopped in my throat. It choked me a great deal. I was troubled with that for about eighteen months. I couldn't lay on neither side. I could only lay flat on my back for eighteen months. There wasn't a doctor in Fredericksburg that could do me any good. So I met a fellow from Washington, [D. C.] and he was telling me how it was with him. From his talk he had the same complaint I had. He talked it in me for to go to Washington and see an old lady. So finally I decided to go. He taken me up there for to see this woman. When I got there now, this woman she came to the window and she says to this man, "You got Jim O. [informant] with you." She'd never seen me before. She says to me, "I know what you come for." She says, "Come on in and look around. I haven't got time to do any readin' for you today [magic delay]." So she says to Henry M. [man who took him to Washing- ton], "Bring him back Friday. So he taken me back. When I walked in she says to me, she says, "You've got a snake in your belly." She says, "Take a seat over there," and commenced then to read. When she commenced to read she brought out several people - she brought their photographs out. She showed me these pictures - she named them, she knowed them [see later]. The old lady had a glass of water in her hand and she passed me this glass of water. So I drank this glass of water. Then after awhile she passed me another glass of water - so I drank that. She said she [some woman in Fredericksburg] gave me something in a glass of water, that's why she [doctor] gave me a glass of water. And right from that I commenced to feeling bad. So she says to me, "You got a snake in you - I can't draw it from you alive." I says to her, "No, I wouldn't like to see it." So she gave me a certain glass of medicine to pass that snake the other way. She gave me a treatment in the hair [scalp treatment], then she put me in a tub of something that was black. She gave me a good bath, and while she was bathing me a lot of smoke came out of my flesh, and right from that I commenced getting better. "You is all right now - you can go back home now and do anything you are big enough to do." And while I was there she showed me a lizard in a jar that she took out of a girl's throat. She had that setting on the shelf in alcohol. It looked just like a lizard you see crawling up a log. She told me she had drawn several snakes from different people. The snake pass from me after I left there - I never did see it. I finally got better. I only spent ten days with her - she charged me $12. John N., he was tricked the very same way, so he came to me and I was telling him about this woman. Then I got it for him to go up and see her. And she cured him the same way. Her name was Mother Jones. She came from North Carolina. [These pictures - she named them - she knew them - were a new device to me; an effective one, more so than the similar and impersonal device of a deck of photographs rather than of cards. These pictures were supposedly photographs of persons she had brought out while reading the cards. Informant could not have known any of them; he was not expected to identify any of them. Henry M., man who took informant to Washington, looks like a man out in the bushes beating up trade for Mother Jones. She could not have known Jim O's name without a letter from Fredericksburg or a telephone call after his arrival in Washington. Her words look around are a most important part of the atmosphere - she wanted him to see her medical museum (see in Index).]
Entry 2747
They goes to a woman across the creek over there right in front of the Catholic cemetery and they got five gray candles. (Is she a young woman or an elderly woman?) This is a woman around forty, jes' a little older woman than me. So they goes to this woman and git five gray candles, as I was told - of my next experi- ence of that kind of work. An' they'd taken those five candles and they wrote my name and they put my name under each one of those five candles. They burn one on Monday for me. De one that was burned on Monday for me that I would be disappointed at de first day of the week. They burned that one all day Monday. That's when ah went out to work that ah'd be confused - nuthin would go right with me, that ah'd lose out, ah'd lose mah job, couldn't keep any jobs. The second one that would be burned on me would be burned on Tuesday. That candle was burned fo' me. That was always mah lucky day when ah wanted to put ovah any business or to go to anyone for any favor. Ah would always make Tuesday mah business day to go fo' money or to transact any business. That Was to defeat me from having any business - to making any progress in any business. The one that they would burn on Wednesday, which would be the third candle - that usually was my general work day, that ah did mah washing and mah ironing. That was to take mah energy away from me that ah couldn't work on Wednesday. Ah would jest pass that day away as a no-good day. Thursday was always a time that ah usually would go to clubs and do different things like that. The candle that they burned on me fo' Thursday would be the candle that ah wouldn't have any vim to do anything in social work, as I have been doing. The one that they burned on me Friday, the whole week that has been wasted, that ah wouldn't have any money coming in to meet my demands for Saturday. And those candles was called hard-time candles, as ah was told. But ah kin tell yo' from self experience ah certainly was hard-timed. Ah've had some of the very best jobs, which at de Country Club, for the Penn Mutual Life Insurance man, at Ryker[son?] School, and would walk away from them without any reason, an' have came to the place that I has nuthin besides three dollars worth of work to support mahself and four children. So ah jes' atchly been hard-timed.
(When did they do this? How long ago did they burn these candles?)
Oh, it's been about - all of this trouble that I have had, that I can atchly relate to you, I have come in contact with it all in the past two years - from one degree on to another.
Entry 2748
Dere was a gurl fren' ah was livin' wit an' dere was another gurl ah Was puttin' in time with. Well, de girl ah was putting in de time with on de outside. (She wasn't living in the same house?) She wasn't living in the same house. Matter of fac' she was living maybe four-five blocks from me. But both liked me. An' de gurl ah was livin' with, me an' her went to church one night, and after we return from church, ah got ready to go to bed and found mah pajamas and pull on. De pressure, yo' understand, and ah turn over an' ah hit somethin' hard. Ah run mah hand in an' found out what it was. It was a candle - a white candle had never been burned. An' so ah takes de candle out and ask dis girl why Was de candle in dere - de girl ah was living with. Well, she didn't know anything about it, you see, and so ah got de candle and goes to Madam Jackson across de creek and consults wit her about dis candle. And so she fest tole me the girl initial, who put it dere. [Initiall Doctors rarely identify persons casting spells (see 907, p.332); but when they do, identification is couched in bague terms. This latter practice occurs in margin-title Zippy Tull, where the fortuneteller Zippy tells her young client that the culprit working against him is "a big dark woman...that don't like your mother and don't like your father, an' she poisoned your dog." I hope to collect all this material in Index under Doctor: identifies spell-caster.] No, fact she didn't put it dere, but she had it put dere. It was a girl, who was a fren' of de girl ah was living [with], put it dere. (You begin with two girls - the second girl didn't put there ~ she had a friend of hers put it there.) A fren' of hers put it there. That was tuh git to dis girl, see - co'se mah girl fren's friend - de one ah was living with. An' dis girl de Madam tole me - say dat dis girl whut had dis candle put dere, she was burning a candle on me fer nine days. An' dis candle had to be burnt at a odd hour, to be burnt from nine or eleven 'clock, which is a odd hour you see - either of two hours, yo' see. But by me finding dis candle and taking it out it was prevented.
(This candle had to be burnt at night.)
Well, de candle had been there three days when it was found - ah slept on it three nights before it was found. [A candle concealed in a bad mattress had beer worked into a feelable position by his tossing.]
(Well, did she say what would have happened to you, if you hadn't found it?)
Well, if ah hadn't found de candle it would mean de girl ah was living with - we couldn't of got along, yo' see. Dat's what dis other girl had it put there fo' - so we couldn't be anything to one another, see, or couldn't git along.
Entry 2749
Dey way 'twas, him and her was frens' an' he got holt of her pocketbook and he stole 'em out dere - took 'em, yo' know. He stole 'em out of her pocket- book. (Took what out?) Papers whut b'long to a car or automobile and some keys and she had two dollars an' he'd taken that. Well, she was doin' that - wanted to make him come back but he wouldn't send 'em. She sent after 'em and he wouldn't send 'em.
(Why didn't she go after them?)
She was 'fraid tuh go, an' she went an' got a man [hoodoo doctor]. He tole her he'd make him bring them back.
(Was this man her husband or?)
No, dis man whut took de things was her friend. An' dis man, after she tole dis man about it, he said, "Well, ah'll make him bring dem back." He went to de drug store and got two candles - red ones. He say, "what is his name?" She told him. He wrote his name on dere, on both de candles, and after he wrote his name - he wrote 'em jest like he wrote 'cross - dey would come right back crossways again on dem candles. He burns out one and start on de other - he give 'em back.
(What happened then?)
Didn't anything. He brought her paper, her keys and her money. And den he went on about his business. Got rid of him. She ain't been bothered with him since.
Entry 2750
[Here is another example of the glove-shaped hand, but unlike the former rite (1990, p.584) we now have one in a candle atmosphere - New Orleans is near. More important, the following story shows some of the listening prob- lems of collecting, among them - speedy talker, confusing pro- nouns and references to persons, delayed explanation, all sorts of things.] Well, they say if you were living here and they wanted tuh move you and run you away - well ah know of a lady, she fo' every morning fo' 'bout nine mornings - she bought a bran'-new box of salt and she took dis salt and cayenne pepper and she would sprinkle it, yo' know, from de front to de back and fo' that reason it would cause a confusion, you know, in the house and they all wouldn't live so good, you know. An' so she would take it and she would sprinkle all over when everyone, say, Wouldn't be noticing, you know. She would do that and then when they all would leave, she would take. She went out to the graveyard early one morning and she got some graveyard dust offa someone's grave, and she brought this dirt back, yo' know, and she'd taken it and where this landlady lived, slept, she unraveled [took out a few stitches of] her pillah and she put it [graveyard dust] in dis pillah. And she had a glove - [look] like it was a han' - and it [the graveyard dust] was in this. And she stuffed it with this graveyard dirt. And she says she mixed it [the graveyard dust] with a - wherever she got dis rattlesnake dust from, ah don't know, but she musta got it from a rattlesnake or something, and she mixed it with somethin' and she stuffed, sewed it in dis pillah while de landlady was gone. [She starts to say the graveyard dust was mixed with rattlesnake dust. Was it? For snake dust, see No. 690, p.230; also No. 1433, p.468 - "an original and brilliant piece of therapeutic thinking."] So after, for about a couple of weeks this lady suffered from her head laying on dis pillah. She suffered severely from her head, you know, and she didn't know what it was, you know. She begin to git dizzy and feel bad, and so she said she was going to see what caused dese headaches. And everything she could take Wouldn't do her any good and so she went tuh a couple of fortunetellers. And so finally a ole lady tole her, fortuneteller told her, said, "Well, yo' ought to look about yore bed," say, "it look like you can't get along in de house, there's always a confusion and everything." And so she said, "You go look up in your mattress, your pillahs or something." So she didn't pay any attention to it all [atall = at all]. So finally she made up her mind to do that. Took her pillahs out and she un- raveled de pillah and she found dis glove stiff like a hand, yo' hand, and so she opened it and she found all de stuff in dere, those different things. An' she didn't know what de cause of it, you see. And so she was afraid and she got someone to look after it fo' her. Well, she'd taken it to dis lady and ast her, and de lady tole her it was graveyard dust and rattlesnake dust and she wanted tuh - someone wanted to make her move or either kill her or something like that. [The preceding account is one of our many examples of that important element in hoodoo theory and practice - the doctor's ability to analyze and identify immediately the nature and cause of an ailment. To look at a handful of dirt and say that it is a mixture of graveyard dust and rattlesnake dust is quite a trick. Only our former doctor-druggist-chemist could have done as well (see No. 1593, p.498). To say these two dusts in a glove in a pillow caused the headache is quite a - well, even doctors admit this knowledge is a gift. At least, though on a lower level, we can now answer our former question - "Was it?"] An' so dis lady [roomer] in de house, you see, she would every morning [for 9 mornings] she would sprinkle dis here cayenne pepper and dis salt all ovah de house. And so after a while they [landlady] asked - cause dey [landlady and roomer]didn't 'gree, yo' know, 'count de fuss and everything - after while they asked her to move out and she [roomer] said she was going to return it back to this person [landlady].
(Was that here in Alabama?)
Yes.
(Well now, go right ahead.)
Well, after she did that - yo' know, she [landlady] did that to make 'em [her] move or to keep her [landlady's] husband, you see. So she [landlady] kept her
[own] husband. And so this other hoodoo lady [roomer because she used hoodoo]
tole her [landlady] that she would return it back. So she [evicted roomer] comes and gits dis hen's aig - a black hen laid dis egg, and she wrote the name [see later] on it. They were living in a house kinda lak dis [house in which I was interviewing] wit a glass do' in de front, chew know, in de house. So soon, early one mawnin' she comes an' throws dis aig up side de door and broke de glass, yo' know - throw de black hen's aig up there. So when he [landlady's husband] goes out - get up dat mawnin' soon - he didn't know - so when he looked all de egg spattered in front of de do' and de glass was out, yo' see, and he walked ovah it befo' he knew it, yo' see, so he looked on de shell and saw where de name was wrote chew know - her [his wife's] name and his name was wrote on dere. And so she said, "Well, dey did dat to break us up - broke dat aig up side de do' to break us up." So she said - an' so she got lye and swept - yo' know, swept it all out an' cleaned it up, yo' know. An' so dis lady [roomer] wrote her a letter and tole her that "Seven years wouldn't be too long for a raccoon to weah a ruffle-bosomed shirt. That's the way she spoke. (Wait, will you talk a little bit slowly. "Seven years wouldn't be too long for a raccoon to wear a ruffle-bosom shirt?") That means she would get her, yo' know. An' so dat was de words she wrote to her. [I know nothing about this stylish raccoon. He sounds like early American ruffled shirts, but the saying or proverb may come from the stage or radio.l An' so finally she would - yo' know, she would burn candles on dis man. She went got - an' got a candle and every time on a certain hour, noonday an' like dat, she would burn dese candles wit his name wrote on it. Black candles, yo' know, and she wrote it on dere. Well, he couldn't stay here and he couldn't stay there, yo' know. He was jest kept, yo' know, like he was, yo' know, de mind up- set all de time, yo' see. And so he got so that he didn't [live] peacefully wit dis woman, because every morning fo' nine mornings, she would come there and had something like - ah don't know whut kind of dust it was - but it was - when you look at it, it looked something like black peppah, yo' know, powdered peppah. She'd sprinkle it all roun' dere do'step, yo' know, fo' nine mawnings. An' he came there and so she took one little piece of his hair out de top of his head while he was asleep, and she sewed that up, and had that fixed with something and put it in a little red bag and sewed dis little red bag up, an' taken a cord string like and put nine knots in dis cord string and she wore it around her waist.
(What else did she do with that string first? Anything else?)
When she took dat string she rolled it in something, yo' know, in some kinda dust, yo' know. She rolled dis string in some kind of a dust, dipped it in dis dust and jest as yo' tie those knots, jest like dat dust would be in dose knots, too, yo' see, because it would wear off, you know, say, just straight round her Waist, but it would be in dat knot, yo' see. An' nine knots she tied it around her waist wit dis little red bag wit his hair in it. An' she took one of his socks - yo' know, one his left socks, and she carried it and had dis sock dressed, vo' know, and she buried dis sock at de foot of her steps, underneath her steps, she buried his sock so he couldn't stay 'way from there, yo' see. Said that she had him so that he had tuh come there. See. And so yo' see, well, he would get so he wouldn't give her any money and some- thin' like that, and so dis ole hoodoo lady tole her to get him to give her one silver dime, yo' know, of his money. And so he didn't know what she wanted him to give her dis dime fo', but she got a dime out of him. And she went an' she had dis dime dressed until it turn almost black like a penny, and she put a hole in it and she wore it around her laig, yo' know. And that's where so she could git his money, you see. She was trying to git him away from dis yere woman [his wife], yo'see. An' so, see, she didn't know that this other woman had his sock buried at her do'step. She had his sock buried there and she was still continuously burning dose candles. And every time she'd come roun' she had some kind a powder tied up in her hans'cuff that she would sprinkle. He thought it was jest powder whut chew powder yore face. It smelled sweet but it was some kin' of love powder yo see. An' she had a little somethin' like a tablet. She'd offer him meals. She would [drop] that in his tea or his coffee.
(Like a tablet?)
Like a little tablet, yes. It would dissolve, you know, an' you couldn't see the mixture in there. You couldn't see the mixture, you know, and you couldn't taste it, see. Well, he would drink this, see. Well, he would drink this and therefo' he couldn't stay away for she had that in him, yo' see. Well, see, she wanted to git dis other woman [wife] out de way, and that's [the reason] she went there and broke dis aig up side her do'. An' she give him those little tablets in his coffee or tea to drink, see, and he begin to suffer wit his stomach badly, an' all like that, and he began to look frail, and look bad, yo' know, because she said if she didn't have him, he could not do her [his wife] no good. See. An' he begin to look frail and bad, an' so no doctor's medicine didn't do him any good. Every time he'd go tuh a doctor, it would make him worser. Yo' know, when you've hoodooed anybody, doctor's medicine not good fo' you, you know. An' so he went - and every time he'd take a doctor's medicine, it would make him worser. And so an' ole lady came by one day and tole him dat he was fixed, chew know, that he was hoodooed, see, because he never would git well, yo' know. And on a certain kinda moon he would git like - git in a fit chew know, kinda rave. And so the ole lady told him that if he'd pay her a sum of money, she could cure him - yo' know, she could git him outa dis kinda fix: An' so, he finally jest scuffled up de money some kind of way. And so she'd taken and brought some saltpeter an' tole him fo' 'bout nine or ten mawnin's to take a bath every mawnin', every day, in dat saltpeter - bathe in that. An' she went out and got some roots out of de woods, some kin'a calomel roots and every- thing and he had to chew dose roots, yo' know - calomel roots, like white-look- ing roots, and she tole him to chew a piece of dat, chew know. An' he had to chew dose roots and he had to take a bath in saltpeter fo' nine mawnings. She made him up a mixture of medicine, chew know. She put so much of turpentine - looked like coffee, somethin', where you see it would settle at de bottom. Well, he had to shake it up and yo' know he would take that, chew know. And after he would bathe in dat saltpeter, he had to take dat medicine and then chew dat root, chew see. An' den she told him at certain time - if he would chew it often - that would pass from him. See, when he chews dose roots, dat calomel yo' know worked up in him. Well, yo' see, after he'd taken that and she tole him that ninth or de tenth day something would pass from him, yo' see - but sure enuff it did. When hit pass from him, yo' know, like de calomel worked him yo' know, it passed somethin' looked like little worms - passed from him little bita worms. An' she tole him that if those worms hada stayed [in] him, it would form like little frogs, and things like that was goin' form in his intestines, inside, chew know. And it pass from him like little worms. And when it passed out, she showed it to him, iThis whut pass from yo', this whut they was puttin' in yo'." [There is one strange feature about so many of these passages of worms, snakes, or lizards. The patient does not see them until the doctor has made an examination and then shows them, or sometimes merely tells about them. No doc- tor has ever gone so far as to say, "If you see them you will die." For further accounts, see Live Things In You, Pp.227-239, and Index.] See, that would kill him slowly, yo' know, and so he was pinin' up and every- thing. So he passed little worms from him in de tenth day - little worms and little somethin' she said was gon'a form frogs. Whatever this was dis woman put in his coffee for him, yo' see, that was forming in him - that would form in him, see, because she got these little tablets and she got this rattlesnake dust - some dust from under a rattlesnake, wherever she got it from and say - and put it in dere, put it in him, fix him so he would stay with her. [Choppy place in cylinder. The old hoodoo woman told wife] if she could get holt of him, she say, if she could get a holt of him and git a little piece of his shirt, she could, yo' know, could stop dis fit on him. See, every change of moon he'd have these spells. [Here are four similar beliefs about fits from general folklore: (1) "Epilep- tic fits...more frequent and...severe during the increase of the moon...." (2) "If anyone has fits, take off their shirt...while having it, cut out the piece over their chest and boil...when cool...give to the person to drink...." (3) "He was having one of these fits. She pull his shirt off over his head, put it on a pan and set it on fire...took the ashes...to feed him a spoonful before each meal...." (4) "Remove the person's undershirt...after an attack, let it smolder on live coals, mix a teaspoonful of these ashes in a glass of holy water, and say In the Name of the Father, Son and Holy Ghost...must be administered three times a day." From FACI, 2ed., p.248.] Well, this ole lady, finally this ole lady died, see - dis ole lady whut was fixing him, yo' know. Well, she died. Well, yo' see, dey found all kinds of stuff, different hoodoo stuff in her place, where dey went tuh see, yo' know, when she died, an' everything. [For finding spells at hoodoo woman's home when she dies, see No. 239, p.66.] Well, this lady, every change of de moon, she still havin' fits. Yo' know, when de person die and fixed yuh, yo' know, yo' don't nevah git ovah it, yo' see. Yo' see, because dey died befo' dey could take it off dem. See. An' she still had those fits after and nobody couldn't take it off because dis was de woman dat put de spell on, see. [See If Evildoer Dies Spell Incurable, p.396.] And so everytime de moon would change she would go crazy-like and see dis man. See. And then when she seen, she didn't want him. Well, finally, this woman went crazy and nobody couldn't do anything for her because she was de one put de spell on her, yo' see, and after she went crazy, well, dey sent her to asylum and after she went tuh de 'sylum, den she died, you see. But de spell was still on dis man, yo' see, after she died. Yo' see, she never did git her mind back. An' so dis man, yo' see - after he come back - he was already heah, and so after she died, it was still on him. He couldn't git it off him because dis ole lady was de one had buried his socks fo' him and he didn't know where. Differ- ent fortunetellers had tole him that she had somethin' of his'n buried somewhere and if he could find it and dig it up, why that could git him bettah, yo' see, because she had got the worms out of him. See. So she had his left sock buried, took his left dirty sock. She fixed it an' buried it underneath de step. And so he would dig all in de yard to try to find where she had buried it. Well, finally, he jest - seemed like he said he had a dream one night to look under his step: They something tole him to look under his steps. [For spirits warning in dreams, see pp.27,116, and Index.] An' so he got up early hisself one morning and went out there an' was digging around under his steps. And when he dug aroun' he struck something like a little can, and when he opened de little can - de top of dat little can, de dust jest flew out, and when he pulled it out he saw one his dirty sock had been buried under there. And in that sock, he opened it, it had some kind of powder and a little rag, and it had nine needles and nine pins sticking in it - nine wit de heads down and nine needles wit de head up. See - in dat sock and so it was sewed up in dat little rag in his sock. And he'd taken dis sock, de whole thing and he carried it tuh a ole man. Yo' see, he carried it tuh a fortuneteller and tole him, say, "Well, dat's whut she had buried, yo' see - why you couldn't stay away from her." An' so, when he'd taken dat and dose little needles - dose needles been in dere so long dey was rusty. An' sos he'd taken dat herself and she washed it in saltpeter - see, she washed dat in saltpeter and he thought she was curing him, but she was making him worser fo' it - 'cause he wanted tuh go back to his wife, yo' see. De woman died dat broke him from his wife. Dat's de one made him move out de house and break up his home, yo' see. An' so he went back then to his wife and try to live with her, see, an' everything. Well, he couldn't live with her because they both died and de spell was on him, yo' see.
(This happened right here in Mobile?)
Yes.
(All right, go right ahead now.)
Well, he'd gone back to his wife, yo' see, after a certain length of time - so many years, yo' see. An', yo' know, he begged her pardon for the way he did her and de woman. She knew dis woman had broke up her home, yo' know, what she did, because afterwards she found out what she had sprinkled all around in her home, yo' know, fo' de confusion and fo' him tuh mistreat her, yo' see. Well, he'd gone back to try to live with her again, yo' see. And so his wife was afraid and so she thought she would have him fixed her- self. After this woman had him that way, she thought she would go an' git some- one to do him the same way, see. So she goes to a fortuneteller and dey tell her that the only way she could do anything with him was to have him dressed. See, was to have him dressed so that - if she don't, he would leave her again because dis spell was still on him and de woman was dead and every change of de moon, he would leave her. See, he had dis spell on him, and said de woman was dead and she was de one had to git it off him. Well, sure enough, every change of de moon he would leave her but she wanted tuh have him dressed. So this fortuneteller wouldn't tell her whut to do, but she sent her to some- body else. So she went - say she jest tell de fortune but de lady had to go to an ole hoodoo. So she goes out in de woods to an ole hoodoo lady and dis ole lady tole her that yes, she could dress him and fix him so that he couldn't leave her. He would have to stay right there, you know, he couldn't leave her. And so she tole her to git her a sum of money and bring it back and she would dress it. [In the preceding paragraph: (1) Some fortunetellers do all types of hoodoo work, or put another way, some hoodoos and doctors tell fortunes; other fortune- tellers, like this one, refer patients to a hoodoo doctor or a specialist. Even I the, Author Becomes a Specialist, on page 278. Is there another example of hoodoos imitating modern medical practice? Yes and no. Specialization in heal- ing is as old as primitive medicine-man and witch-doctor. Temple incubation Was a speciality of early Greek healers, ancestors of present-day Doctors of Medi- cine. (2) "out in de woods." Here is the old witch of fairy tales and reality. For this isolation as well as personal appearance, see pp.294-301, especially Nos. 849 and 859. (3) For dressing the money, see one man's remarkable version of this rite - Trickery by Doctor. Cast it into Oblivion, p.268. However, not all dressing of money is trickery.] Well, she did that. She went to this ole lady, and dis ole lady tole her that every three hours - she give her some kind of something like incense to burn. Tole her to burn this incense every three hours, and sulphur. Tole her to burn incense and sulphur and write his name on a white candle and roll it in some sugar. See, she said sugar, seemed like that would make everything sweet fo' him, yo' see. Salt is for confusion, chew know and sugar is for sweet. See, that's the way it works. Tole her to roll dis candle in sugar and write his name backwards on dere, yo' see, and stick it in a little saucer and put it in de cor- ner of her room. See. And jest 'bout time de spell come on him, fo' her to burn it. See. An' dat would make it sweet and de spell wouldn't be on him. An' so tole her to take dat candle and burn it and then to burn dis here sulphur every three hours in her home - this here sulphur and this incense. The incense is sweet too. That makes a sweet smell in yore home. Well, she did that. An' she tole her whenever he take a bath - see, next time he'd take a bath - tuh bring a little of his bathwater. Put it in a little cup or something, stop it up and bring it tuh her - what he bathe in. Well, she fixed his water. He didn't know, yo' know, she was goin' tuh pore de water out after he'd taken a bath. She took some water in de cup, some of his dirty water, and she carried it to dis lady. She stopped it up in a little bottle and carried dis dirty water to dis ole woman. Well, dis ole woman, she took his bathwater that he bathed in and she mixed it with something else in a bottle and shook it up and tole her to take dis bottle and bring it back and stand it up in de corner of her room where ain't no one kin see, and everytime he'd go out de do', she goes an' watch his feet and git his left track and bring de dirt back to her. Yo' know, jest take her han' and rake dat track back and wrap it up in some paper and keep it in her purse. Well, every time he would leave dat would make him come back. See, when you git his tracks dat'll make him come back. Well, whenever he would leave out, sure enough she went and got his track. See, she got dat track and she wrapped it up in de paper and had it in her purse and she had dis water in her room, yo' know. An' so, every three hours in de day she would burn dis here stuff, yo' know [this candle and incense and sulphur]. It acted all right for a good long while but see, every once a while, it would die down - it would die down and den she had to go an' do it again. Dis acted all right for a little while, till he begin to git in a rage agin, yo' see. So dis lady tole her that on the way she had to get something in him. See, she had to fix him in that way. Yo' see. [The preceding paragraph reveals one of the great principles of magic, perhaps the greatest after intention - magic power is not permanent. Our best examples of this are those magic objects closest to the believer's heart and mind - the hands. Among their many characteristics, these helpers: (1) have degrees of power (p.576), (2), observe a time limit (p.577), (3) must be fed (p.578f.), and (4) need recharging, which sometimes requires a doctor or a specialist, a hand- maker. A hand lives and helps only because a spirit dwells in it. Even when all amenities and regulations have been kept and the indwelling spirit is contended, it can be killed - chased from its temporary home - by the spirit of a stronger hand. Killing happens often in a gambling game where every man carries a hand. So, here is another rule of magic - a weaker spirit cannot function in the presence of a stronger spirit. But the owner of the weaker hand can kill the spirit or power of the stronger hand - page 641 and Index.] Well, she thought she was fixing hi - instead of fixing him fo' good, she was fixing him fo' bad looked like, don't you see, because whut dis woman give her, de mixture in his food, see. She wouldn't eat what he eat, yo' see, because she Was putting it in his stuff and sprinkling it on his meat. You see she would put it on de meat that he would eat. An' so when he taste it - de different taste in de meal yo' know and wanted her to taste, she proclaimed that she didn't like that kind of meat. Yo' know, she'd make excuse to keep from eatin' it herself. See. And see, every time he'd eat dis meat hit would make him sicker, see. But she put it on his meat. Dis woman give it to her and told her to put it on there and so he found dis here dirt in her purse, yo' see. He opened de pa- per - he went in her purse and he found dis dirt in dere, see, but she didn't know that he found the dirt. He kept the dirt fo' to carry it tuh see what it was. See. An' so he carried dis dirt to see whut it was. And dey told him it was his tracks - one dem hoodoos, another one, tole him it was his tracks, and says, this woman is giving him something in his food. Well, see, he would eat this food, yo' see, and he got so that he would dry up - dried up jest as little as he could be. It was whut she was feeding him off of.
(Put them [his foot tracks] in the grave?)
Yes. An' she tole him - dis hoodoo lady tole him that it wouldn't be long 'fore dey be burying her by she burying dese tracks. And so dis hoodoo woman gave him something. Yo' know, he didn't know that this woman was dressing dis other one fo' him, see, an' so when he goes back to her, something she puts on him, well he got it on her, see, by being close together, got it on her and she come with something like a itch, yo' know, all over her. [For an amazing example of this common trick, see No. 10, p.7.] She had an itch all over her and she'd go to doctors an' everything and de more they would treat her fo' dis itch, de worser it would git. And so it kept itching till all between her fingers got sore - see, all between her fingers become broke out like you would have pellegra yo' know, all that itch. But it would git between her fingers and all her nails and it got between her toenails. See. An' she broke out in sores, sores all be- tween her nails an' everything tull they had to bathe her hands and wrap 'em up in a piece yo' know. And all between her body - all down there between her body, she broke out in sores and everything, yo' see. And so she thought about this letter dis woman wrote an' tole her that seven years wouldn't be too long for a raccoon to wear a ruffled-bosom shirt. See, that whut she meant, she was goin' tuh kill her - see, tuh get dis man, see. An' she had dis man dressed fo' her. See. Well, after she broke out in sores and everything like dat, well, see, he had done buried her tracks to de graveyard, you see. Well, finally dey couldn't cure her and she broke dese sores all out and it come on de inside eatin' her up. Whut she had got inside her, it would just ete her on through, ete her up. An' she died. Finally she did bury her. See. An' so this woman told her dat, see, and dey all remembered whut she said - that she would do that to get her. An' after she do that - after she [roomer] got this man, yo' see, then this man disliked her. After he had done killed his wife and hoodooed her, well, he disliked her, see. He turned against her then, and so after he turned against her, he say, jest like she killed his wife, he would turn that right back on her and do her de same way, and she told him that he couldn't do it. See. An' so he said, "Surely could." Well, after dis man tried to fix her she would go an' git cured, see, bathing in dat saltpeter and salt, see, and that would keep everything off of her. And she wouldn't eat anything from him, see. An' so finally, he brought her some ice cream and she ate the ice cream. She didn't think anything Would hurt her, see. An' she ate de ice cream and after she ate de ice cream, dis man tole her he would get her. See, 'cause he had done went back to dis ole [hoodoo] lady dat killed his wife, to fix her. An' dat ole lady put de stuff in de ice cream - gave it to him and he put it in de ice cream.... [The hoodoo woman told the wife to] "Get a piece of his shirt-tail and his bathwater." Yo' got whut she got, yo' know, from him. She had tole her to take that bathwater and she put dat piece of shirt-tail in dis bottle, see, and she sticks nine needles and pins in it and shook it up and told her to take that and go in one fo' corner of de house and bury that.
(One of the four corners of her house.)
Outside - not under the steps - de fourth corner of her house and bury it and then jest, as she burying it, she had to say some kind of hoodoo and put a evil curse on. Cause she knew that the water had him fixed - his bathwater - and he had to go cross de water. So finally he takes a notion to leave - to leave her, see. And so she said, well, to cross water - well, that would make all that go back [on person fixing his bathwater]. So he left here and so he went an' got on a ship and went away cross de water. He was leaving across de water to git dat off him. Said that this woman know that he was going away, said she'd rather fo' him to leave and not come back. The one he went back to - de woman died.
(The woman killed his wife and then he killed this woman. That the idea?)
No, de woman got killed - dat de one he was running around wit. He couldn't git de spell off him an' so he goes back and makes up with his wife. See. This woman was living in the house and broke his wife and him up, yo' see, and tore up de home and the wife left and that give her a chance. See, she put dis stuff in her pillah, and so then after the woman got out, de wife turned it back on her. See. An' so she [roomer] lost her mind an' everything and de ole woman dat fixed de wife, she died, see, and dey couldn't git de spell off [the wife]. See. And dis woman [roomer] went crazy and dey sent her away and she died. Then he finally makes up his mind to go back to his wife, yo' see, to git a reconcilia- tion with her, yo' know, tuh beg her pardon, after so many years. Well, you see after he went back with his wife - she knew that this woman had done her that and broke up her home - well she didn't care for him much. But he wanted - but he had dis spell on him - dey both [women - roomer and hoodoo woman] died and dey couldn't git de spell off him. And every change of de moon he'd have these spells, see, because dis woman throwed dis egg and put dis spell on him. He had these spells and so the wife said that she would go have him fixed so she could keep him. So she goes tuh have his fixed, yo' see, and dis woman tole his wife to git his bathwater, see; and then git dis candle and roll it in sugar - see, that was to make him sweet.
(Well, now, whose track was buried out in the grave?)
Oh, it was this woman's track that was buried out in de grave.
(Which woman, the first one?)
The first woman - she was de one.
(There are only two women in the story?)
That was all - one man - two womens and one man. De wife and de woman and dis man. (The woman who was trying to take him away died in the asylum. Then the wife died too, didn't she?) Well, later - after - but he went back to the wife. See. And after de wife didn't care fo' him, see, then she fixed him so he wouldn't have these spells - she tried to git these spells off him, so she would git de candle and roll it in sugar an' everything. An' so then she seen she didn't care for him and then [he] goes and has her tracks buried in de graveyard, see. Dis man fixed her.
(What was he fixing her for?)
Cause she didn't want him. (Was she trying to kill him or was he trying to kill her? Or was he trying to make her take him back or what?) Well, he wanted her to take him back. Well, after she took him back, you see he would git dem spells on the change of de moon and he would leave again. He wouldn't act right. See.
(When did he cross water?)
Well, he crossed water when de woman tole him dat de only way he would git dis spell off him, he would have to cross de water. See.
(The spell his wife put on him or the spell the other woman put on him?)
It's de spell the other woman put on him.
(The part that was in the beginning of the story?)
Yes, that goes in the beginning of it. You see, de wife is de one that burned de candles on him and tried to git de spell off him. So he goes and gits his wife track - he's de one - de hoodoo woman told him to bury it in de graveyard, and he went and buried it out dere like she told him.
(That's what killed her?)
That whut killed her and that's whut made her think of de letter that she re- ceived a long time ago. See, dis ole lady was working on 'em both. See, she was pretending to be friends to each one of 'em, but she wasn't. [For doctor "pretending to be friends to each one of 'em," see two excellent examples, No. 780, p.257, and No. 782, p.258.] See, dis same ole lady died, yo' see, who was pretending to be friends to both of them, but she wasn't. Yeah, he had to cross water to git rid of his sins, because she had his water and everything buried in de fourth corner of her house. So, that itch when she broke out like that, that whut killed her. And he couldn't git those spells off at de change of de moon - he would go crazy and everything. They both [women] got out of dere [died] and dat's when dis [hoodoo] woman [told] him he would cross water. See, he took a voyage away cross water - see, he left to get rid of this. And de last that they heard from him, dey said he was gittin' better of those spells.
intended household discord attributed to salt/cayenne sprinkling. No clinical diagnosis, proven causation or definite aggressor/victim identity is inferred. These are attributed source occurrences; outcomes remain unverified.
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Entry 2751
In the year of 1928 I was going with a married man. Quite natural I knowed that was wrong and she found it out and she sent a bottle there to my house - and my brother was sitting on the porch. And so when I come home from work that evenin' the bottle was there. And so the bottle had water in it, I imagine. My mother told me not to open it. It had a lot of needles and a stopper and a cord- string tied up as if, you know, to hold the stopper out of the water - just a plain long beer bottle [probably a dark bottle]. So my mother had taken it up to a woman what, you know, knew.
(Where was this bottle?)
It was at my house - it was down by the washstand. They had give it to - the woman had give it to my brother, see. And my brother went and give it to my mother and my mother set it down in my room by the washstand and so she told me when I come home to go there and get the bottle. So, finally, I had a fear run over me and besides, about it, I never believed in this kind of stuff until this come about. And so after she told me to go and get the bottle, I went and opened [I wanted to open] it - I said, "Mama, this bottle is suspicious." She says, "Well, don't open it." I say, "Yes, Ma, I is, I'm not afraid." She said, "Don't you open it." And she taken the bottle and went on up to a woman's house with the bottle and she told the woman. The woman told my mother to take the bottle and empty it in a bayou of water or stream of water. See. So I went to Tallulah to work. I left from away from there after I thought I was going to get hurt, you know. I left home anyway and I went to Tallulah.
(Where is that?)
Tallulah, Louisiana. [About 25 miles west of Vicksburg, Mississippi.]
(All right.)
I worked over there. And after I went over, she sent me a little envelope with sand or something inside of another little envelope about dis long, and she said on there, "Six months from today your grave number will be 65 - six months from today." Well, I got scared and I was a person that never did like to tell my friends nothing about that. In fact I didn't believe in it. So I commenced to pining away and then I was losing my mind. People here in Vicksburg can shore tell you here in Vicksburg that I really lost my mind. So a friend of mine had mentioned it to a friend of mine, and she told me about a fellow. I don't know whether he's black or white. He stays in New Orleans, his name is B. B. McConnick. He stays over in Algiers. And I wrote him concerning about it. And after he wrote in a letter and told me about a dream I had. I believed in what he was telling me to do.
(Did you have a dream?)
I had a dream that I - there was some money in a old empty house for me. [For dreams of buried treasure, see 387, p.116; 426, p.127; etc.] And after I wrote this man like she [the girl] told me to write him, why he was telling that, and I was - and that's what made my belief come that he'd know what he was talking about - why I believed in what he told me to do.
(Now, wait. You had this dream and you told this man in Tallulah?)
No, I ain't told no one about it - this dream - nobody know nothing about this dream but my family folks - about this dream and the money in the house.
(I see.)
And after I told this friend of mines over there [in Vicksburg] about this woman had done sent me this stuff, and I was sick and stayed sick, well she told me about this man.
(I see - the man in Algiers?)
In Algiers - his name was Mr. B. B. McConnick. I don't know whether he is black or white. And so I wrote him and he wrote me a letter back and told me to send him $5.75 and he explained in the letter about the dream I had. Well, I believed in him, see. So I sent the money to him. I sent the money to him and he sent me a self-addressed stamp [envelope for the money]. And he sent me and told me what to do, and he sent me black candles and he told me this here black candle would burn against the parties what was harming me. Well, he told what to do - he told me to take a glass about like that, just an ordinary jelly glass, and fill it half full of sugar and stick it down in the sugar.
(This black candle?)
This black candle.
(Just one?)
He sent me more than one, cause [I sent him] $5.06, but after they give out, he told me I could get 'em from my local drug store. And he told me to use these candles six, twelve and six evening every evening. [This is the well-known 6-12- 6 time formula.] And finally I did that.
(Put this candle down in the sugar?)
Down in the sugar. He told me to not to never blow the candle out - I never seen this man before, and he told me, "Don't blow it out" - to take mv middle finger and my thumb and wet it, and say, "I wish you would leave me alone," put- ting the candle out at the same time, but not blow it. And really I did that and that woman. (Now wait a minute. How long did you let those candles burn at six, twelve and six?) Fifteen minutes - fifteen minutes.
(And when you had burned one whole candle?)
No, sir, you burn that every day. (Well, when that first candle burned out, what did you do? Burn another one then?) Could use another.
(How many did you use altogether?)
Oh, I just guess. I done even forgot how many I used, but I used just some of 'em 'cause I wanted that off of me. And really, that man helped me 'cause I know I was wrong: You see. And it turned right to that home - that woman was getting back just like I was getting, see. And I thought - two or three time I certainly felt sorry for her and I stopped using that stuff. Now, the other experience, 'cause I used to didn't believe in it until this woman was doing me like that, you see. Cause I was wrong, you see, going with her husband. But that other, I don't know nothing about that, but I'm explaining you something I really experienced my own dear self. [The preceding trick could have been performed in several ways. Friend of mine who recommended McConnick was surely his foreign correspondent for the Vicksburg district; she being his only source of information about the dream. What informant wanted could be taken care of for $5.75. Her dream about the buried treasure showed that all problems would soon be solved; she would also find the hidden wealth. The reader will notice immediately that $5.75 contains uneven numbers, which read inside outward 75 and outside inward 57. This is for- ward and backward magic, though not the pendulum magic frequently met in Jacks (p.190f.). Pulsating or heart-beat magic might be a better term. After the money was received, the candles were delivered. The package contained a printed notice something like: "These candles you ordered have been burned in the fol- lowing manner by troubled persons who claim for them the benefits of health and peace. We sell them as curios. The so-and-so drug store in your town sells these candles." There was no second letter as informant implies. All communi- cation was. brief and vague (see He'd Never Write You Much, p.319f.). McConnick is primarily a distributor of candles - a business man and surely a white man.]
Entry 2752
My husband left me and I wanted him to come back. I loved the man, I love him 'till today, and he jis' walked away from me without any cause that I know of. Course I was jealous of 'im and I wouldn't let 'im go when he felt like going all the time to those awful taverns because he was drunkard - ev'ry time he go out he'd get drunk. Well, I tried to keep him at the house all I could and make things as pleasant as I could for him, see - so he would like home, see. I had a beautiful home across the street there, and there was nothing for him to worry for. He was a working man, he was no sweetie - he was a working man, worked every day. But when he'd go out and get amongst mens and womens, he'd get drunk and carry on. And if he had his payday before he came in, he'd let 'em rob him. He'd be home all the week, ev'ry day in the week, but on Saturday night when he got his pay he'd go ev'rywhere but home. I got disgusted with him. He went away from me and then I said, "Well, I'm going to try to see if I can get him home." I had heard so much, you know. I say, "I'm going to try a mess and see if I can get him home." So I goes across the river [to Algiers], knowing a woman through somebody else.
(What was her name?)
Ah forgot her name now. I got her name of course on a paper at home. But anyhow, I went over there to see her and ask her about it. I says, "Listen, '' I says, "Miss Whatchacallum, my husband done left me. ". And I says, "Is there any way that I can get him back, you think?" She says, "Yes, sure," she says, "you can get him back." She says, "How long has he been gone?" I says, "He been gone about five weeks now." She says, "Well, I'll be over there to see you," she says, "and when I come," she says, "I'll tell you what to get." So she says - and I says, "All right." So she says, "The first thing while you's downtown, go by the Ten-Cent Store and get me a 25c box of canary bird seeds." I went there and got 'em [after I left her]. She says, "When I come over, I'll tell you what else to get." When she come over she say, "Get me a pound of sugar, one pound of sugar and she said, "get me two boxes of raisins." You see, one pound of sugar, two boxes of raisins and 25c worth of bird seed. Well, she took a pan I have over there, a blue pan, and she mixed all that together. She made me write his name. She made me write his name, you know, each nine times - made me write his name nine times and after writing his name nine times, she made me write my name right on top of his name. My full name right on top of his name - each nine times on two different lines. Then she took that paper and put it in the bottom of the pan - I noticed her - put that paper in the bottom of the pan and she mixes all this mixture right up together and put that on the canary bird seeds and all. But, of course, he hasn't come back home yet.
(What else did she do? What did she do with that then?)
She made me put the pan back under where it couldn't be seen and then she told me to get the candles. She made me get three candles - ten-cent candles, long candles.
(What color were they?)
White candles - what you call white wax candles. I got the three ten-cent candles and she told me to dig a hole in [for] each in that. That thing [mixture] was about that thick with that ingredients - was that raisins and that in the pan, and put these candles, put three candles.... ["She coughs. Unintelligible. She has a coughing spell." Penciled notation made when transcription checked with cylinder.] (Well, how did she put them? She put one there and where did she put the other one?) [Coughing again.] Three together.
(She put three in a row. All right.)
And let 'em burn nine days.
(And let them burn out?)
And let 'em burn out. She says, "Don't blow 'em, pinch them out." So I burns [coughing again].
[We must allow for brief pauses during these coughing spells.]
(Now, those three candles wouldn't last nine days, would they?)
Now, when those burns low, I just lighted three more and just pinched them out and take them out of that little hole, you see, and put three more there, see.
(I see. All right, go ahead.)
Uh-huh.
(When the nine days were up, what did you do?)
After they burned out - see, they burned as long as they can. Then after they burned there nine days, she told me not to disturb that pan, let it that pan stay there. And so it stayed there and still it haven't made any success with me. But even so, she was charging me for it, so I said, "Well?" She told me to come back over there. Well, I'd taken sick and I haven't been back over there since. I used about a dollar's worth [candles] - ten-cents apiece.
Entry 2753
Because that I was kind of out and down, and that's why I went there to 'em. And so, as I goes there to 'em, they tells me what candles to light. Some- times they tell me to go light - put a light. (What did you see when you went into the room?) What did I see when I went in the room? Well, the room was dark and I just see them little lights - them little lights burning. They have the room dark and them little lights burning at the altar.
(What was the person wearing?)
They was wearing a robe.
(What color was it?)
A lavender robe.
(Anything on their head?)
Yeah, they wear a crown on their head.
(What was the color of the crown?)
The crown was lavender and had a little silver on it - little silver spangles on top of it.
(Then, were you supposed to do anything when you came in or went out?)
Yeah, when I'd come in, I'd get on my knees like this [demonstrates].
(Down on your knees.)
Uh-huh - and do this here [demonstrates].
(Make the sign of the cross.)
Yes sir. And after I'd get on my knees, I'd go to this altar and I'd get on my knees at that place and pray to that saint - for that saint to do things for me. And after I gets through praying to that saint, if I wants the other [saint] to do something, I'd go to the other one [saint] and say something. (Do you mean that this person you went to - they have these various saints in the room?) Yes, in the room. (Well, when you first came in did they ask you what you wanted? Or anything? Or did they speak to you? What did they say when you first came in?) When I first come in, she'd ask me - no, when I first come in there, I'd make that sign of the cross. And then I'd go to one of them saints and then she'd ask me what did I want, and she'd tell - and she'd tell me what candle to go and make my wish to. And then I'd make my wish and if I want to put a silver offering, I'd put that dime there. And if I'd go to St. Peter, I'd put that key there.
(That woman you went to had these various things around her room?)
Around in her room.
(With candles?)
With candles.
(I see. What did she call herself? A fortuneteller, a spiritualist or what?)
She would call herself a spiritualist.
(What did she charge you for your trip?)
She would just - I would donate to her.
Entry 2754
When you first go there, you have to wait until your name is called and then you go in and tell her what you want. And if you wanted to call - she will tell you different things and you'll have her to do things for you. She'll tell you what to do and give you a price on it and then give you the things to use to that effect. And whatever things you prefer, why whatever you want her to do with you - burn your candle, you can leave the money with her to burn your candle for you. And then she will give you so many candles to use at your house to burn so many hours.
(Was that woman dressed in any particular way?)
Well, some of them has on robes and some of them they are just dressed normal. Some of them use white cords; some of them use purple cords and robes - I mean cords they tie around their waist, robe cords, but different ones have different colors.
(Do they have these candles burning in this room - on altars or something?)
Yes, if you want them to do work for you, they have the candles right there; but they have the candles burning all the time - there has been somebody there all the time before you. And whatever you want them to do, they take that candle that you want to put to that saint, or whatever you want done to that person, and put it up under that person, they light that candle when you are there. You give them so much to keep it burning. And then they give you candles you can burn, and you keep them at your home. I think I've tole you all that I know - all the good things and bad things, too, that you could do.
Entry 2755
(Do the people over there have altars?)
Yes, they still got altars over there, yes sir. (How do they handle that? Supposing I'd go over to see one, what would they have me do? I wonder what would be the ceremony they'd go through?) Well now, you see, as you go in, the altar is setting just like this here [points] vanity [bureau] there - yes, sir. The altar is setting there. Well, it's always, the candles are always lit, you see, with saints all around it. It always stays lit night and day. See, you go in there, probably you put a nickel in the box and you light you a candle, if it's a penny even, you can put that in there and you light a candle. You get down on your knees and you prays. And whatsoever prayer you want and whatsomever you pray for or want done, you pray to the saint that you know would help you, understand. You get there and you pray to that saint. Now and then the mother of that church, she would come to you - see, she would talk to you and she would give you information. She would pray for you, and probably she may give you a medal. She'd bless the medal and everything - well, pray over it rather and give it to you. Then, she would tell you just what to do and how to do it. See, she liable to tell you, say, "Well, when you go back over to the New Orleans side," say, "you go to the Crackerjack Drug Store," and she say, "you go and get you some goat- weed." She say, "You get some goatweed and you go out in the woods - if you can get to the woods, if you know how. You go out in the woods and you get some banana leaves." You see. "But get the root of the banana tree, rather - get the root of that," she says, "and you come back and you bring it chere to me, but bring it back in nine days." She say, "Let it be dry when you bring it back." Well, you bring it back to her and she will fix that for you. Well now, when she fix it, she liable to tell you, she say, "I want $100 for it." You pay it to her because you wants something done for yourself. She going to use sugar with it, she is going to use cinnamon with that stuff. She gotta take and sprinkle vine- gar onto it and all that - cook all that together - take a red onion and cook all that together. Make one thing out of it. When she get through with it - it will be just about that much stuff when she finish. She tell you, now, put it in a sack or anything and put that in your pocket and go ahead on. And you have the luck and success in anything you undertake to do. (What do they call these people that do that sort of thing? What would you call her?) Well, we call 'em just by name - some people call 'em the hoodoos - some call 'em spirituals - some call 'em - ah forget the other name they call 'em - but we call 'em all kind of names - fortunetellers and all such things as that, you see.
(Well, does she wear a robe or dress up in any particular way?)
They generally wears a gown, yes sir - you know, a big white gown. Some of 'em be - have a black gown, you know. We call 'em gowns. They look more like gowns than they is robes - and tassel and all around - just in order - just on the order of a priest, you see.
Entry 2756
See, hit's [the altar is] made like a table, and she got all kinds of different candles, you know, on it, and on the table it's shaped like a pulpit. You done seen a pulpit. Well, they got all kind of different candles - got white candles, they got green candles, they got pink ones, they got red ones. So I went to another man and I asked him could he do anything to help me. (Now wait a minute. This woman you said that had this altar. Was she dressed in any particular way?) Yes, she had a robe.
(What kind of a robe?)
A blue.
(A blue robe?)
Yes, sir.
(Anything on her head?)
A crown.
(A crown?)
Yes, sir.
(What kind of a crown?)
It's a white piece of cloth was made like a crown.
(I see - piece of white cloth.)
Just like a piece of cloth - just like you would put something [on your head].
(When you came in there, did she make you do anything?)
No more than sit down.
(Just told you to sit down?)
And wait until she get ready.
(I see. And how was this man dressed that you went to see?)
Well, he wears clothes just like you wear but he had a white robe over his clothes.
(I see - a white robe. Anything on his head?)
Not nothing on his head at all.
(Did he have an altar?)
Yes, sir, he had an altar.
(What did it look like, this altar?)
Well, his altar look just like a pulpit. Well, he got candles and saints' Pictures and flowers - you know, all that. (I see, I see.) [My note on original transcription reads, "This was told in conjunction with 1088:9 & 1089:10.]
Entry 2757
[The following statements come from the interview with the girl men- tioned in the Introduction because of her youthful age for this kind of work. She - though familiar with usual hoodoo devices - is more interested in her own brand of spiritualism cen- tering around a special power rite. Two candles, one behind the other, are used - the forward blue candle named Uncle, the backward white candle named Master. Uncle or Unkas, a well-know spirit, we shall meet again (see, THE UNKAS MAN, in Interviews section). She does not say so, but any object upon which her candles rest - table, mantelpiece, bureau, box - must be called an altar. She operates a private shrine.] Well, yo' see, it's lak dis. Yo' take two candles an' yo' burn 'em. As yo' burn dese two candles, yo' tell 'em, say, "Well, Jesus, ah want chew tuh back me up. Ah want chew tuh back me up as ah go in back of mah spirit." An' as yo go, the man will tell yo', "Well, yo' come fo' a job. Well, ah kin give you a job." See, it be dat light is helpin' yo where yo' set dat light an' it burn itself. An as [before] yo' go dere yo' take an' git chew some bay rum an' yo' rub in yore han's. As yo' git dis bay rum, yo' take an' take yo' a piece of rag, an' as yo' take a piece of rag, yo' always keep dat rag movin' in yore han's, an'as yo' go in dis place when he begin' tuh ask yo' 'bout a job, well all yo' do yo remembah de light, an' if yo' say, "Lord, he'p me an' back mah light up," well, dat light will always give yo' power an' always help yo', an' yo' go dere an' dat person will give yo' a job. Maybe somebody's been dere a long time an' tryin' tuh git a job an' dey don't know how tuh git a job. All yo' do is set de light.
(What color of light? Any color?)
De bes' light is de white an' blue light, tuh git. De white one is Master an de blue one is Uncle. Yo' always say Master back of Uncle, an' yo' ast him tuh do sech-an'-sech a thing an' he'll do this thing. Yo' take a coconut but yo' must break it square. Yo' know a coconut is round but yo' must keep it square. Sometime yo' cain't break 'em - dey hard fo' yo tuh break 'em square, but it gotta be broke, yo' know, half in two in square. An' yo' take dat coconut an' yo' take de meat out of it an' yo' take a person name an' yo' write it down, but chew make a seal. Yo' evah saw a seal? [Evidently I nod, yes. I previously had seen at least one seal in St. Petersburg, Florida, see 2280, p.644.] Yo' makes a seal an' yo' take dat person's name an' yo' put it down in dat coconut an' dat Rabbit Syrup. Well, yo' take dat Rabbit Syrup an' dat cinnamon an' git chew some bay rum, an' yo' mix dat Rabbit Syrup an' dat pulverized sugah, dat fine, fine sugah whut chew buy in de box. Well, yo' sweeten it. Mix all dat together - de cayenne an' de Rabbit Syrup an' de cinnamon an' de bay rum. Yo' take his name an' yo' make a seal out dat papah, but chew must nuse brown Papah an' yo' put it down in dat coconut an' yo' take yo' a light. Yo' take yore light an' yo' put it - yo' see, yo' have dat seal made round, but chew have tuh cut it out round, yo' see, de brown papah, an' yo' put dat name, write it right in de middle of de seal.
(Just once?)
Yes, an' yo' put de light in de center of dat an' yo' burn it. Yo' make yore wish to dat light, whatsomevah yo' want, an' yo' burn it.
(What kind of light - any color?)
Well, yo' kin take Uncle light. It's a blue light, Uncle. Dat's a spirit. An' yo' kin take a lemon.
(Well, now what does that do? When you burn that in there?)
Well, yo' kin keep a person down - dey won't prosper, cain't git a job no way. Yo' understan' about dat. (To put the candle out [the candle someone is burning against you], every morning you say you get up and do what?) Yo' go to de hydrant befo' yo' say anything an' yo' let de hydrant run an' dat's tuh pray - dat's de way ah do's. Ah goes tuh de sun an' ah prays, an' whilst ah'm prayin' ah let de hydrant run an' ah take three drops - three glasses of watah, an' aftah de sun go down, yo' throw de watah tuh de sunset an' ast de spirit whatsomevah yo' dealin' with tuh give yo' power tuh put dat light out.
(What spirit would you deal with? Any spirit that you wanted to?)
Well, it's diff'rent people - de spirit contained wit yo', see. [Each person has a different or special spirit.] Yo' have a guide an' ah have a guide.
(It is your own spirit that you are getting?)
Yes. If a person tell yo', "Ah want chew tuh do sech-an'-sech a thing fo' me, '' an' [or] yo' want a person, a man. Lak yo' say, "Ah want dis man an' ah'm gon'a git dis man an' nobody have dis man." Well, yo' take a tub of watah an' yo' set dis tub ovah an' yo' take an' light a black candle. Yo' don't light dis candle, yo' put it in dis watah an' let dat watah trickle [from the faucet into the tub]. Put dis man name an' den yo' cut chew a coconut an' cut chew coconut an' put some dust [drops of melted wax] on it. Yo' evah heah dat? An' yo' let dat candle draw [drop] aroun' down in dis place heah. Dat be dat man name. [Melted wax from black candle drops on man's name written on brown paper at bottom of coconut.] Now, he's driftin' all aroun' an' aroun'. [Because his name under black candle in coconut is floating on the water in the tub; the dripping faucet makes it running Water.] He cain't nevah git a job. He nevah kin work. Every time he draw tuh yo', well he gittin' somewhere; but when he leave yo', look lak he driftin'; an' if he want any othah woman, yo' kin drift him away from dis woman - but nobody else, he's gotta have yo' an' nobody else. An' if yo' don't want give him nuthin, all yo' do, jis' put dat candle in dere an' let it drip an' so many hours. Yo' turn de chairs upside down. An' lak if a person goin' tuh co't an' dis person wanted tuh he'p yo' outa co't. All yo' take an' do, take St. Peter pit- chure an' turn it upside down, an' as yo' turn it upside down, dash some watah in [on] dat [picture] an' aftah yo' dash it, den dey come on outa jail. [See, BEER FOR ST. PETER - CIGAR FOR ST. ANTHONY, in InterviewS Section.] But chew de one he'p dem yo' see. Dat's de understandin' of luck. Yo' take an' do so many things with luck. See, den agin lak if yo' want a person - well, ah say, "Ah'm goin' make yo' drift." Well, yo' say, "Well, yo' cain't make me drift." Well, ah'll take an' take yore name, an' take a bottle of watah an' throw that bottle of watah undah mah laig or 'neath mah laig - mah left foot, an' throw it so [she demonstrates], an' tell it tuh go sech-an'-sech a place but don't nevah come back, an' as dat bottle go roun' an' jis work roun' an' roun' [under my foot], mah mind don't nevah come to me, but ah'm driftin' ever' day, goin' off an' off. Don't nevah see nobody, always thinkin' of things, always thinkin' things - diff'rent. [Her mind is faster than her words. My name is written on a piece of paper and stopped up in a bottle of water. She throws the bottle on the floor, puts her foot on it and begin to roll it back and forth. Sometimes, not here, the bottle is kicked about the room and cussed. At the last moment notice how she changes my name to her own. This is one of the many rolling rites in the New Orleans area - see margin-title St. John's Water, p.639, and Index.]
Entry 2758
[Good material about the private shrine is difficult to find. Most of my information I have included under subsection Saints or left intact in the Interviews section. Here I will include one more example - a unique offering of food to enemy spirits living and dead.] (Your aunt did this, had the altar?) Yes - she's daid now.
(And you say she burnt these candles?)
Yes, an' she'd put food there.
(What would she put the food there for?)
Fo' certain people - the people she thought, yo' know, would harm her. An' she would put their name on a piece of papah, an' write it there.
(Well, who ate that food?)
Well, she believed in de spirits.
Entry 2759
(Now, in your place of business, do you use an altar in your work?)
No, I didn't. I never did have that. I don't need no altar because my altar, which is myself, is in my brain - you see, because I was gifted for that. (Were you born in Louisiana, though?) Born in Louisiana and I'm over in McDonoghville, over the river. [Quoted from No. 860, p.301.] [Most doctors are gifted - see To Become a Doctor, I Was Gifted, p.273, and Doctor in Index. My words your place of business. How untactful to a man who could be worshipping at an altar! I mean worship, because altar in hoodoo is a religious object for a true believer. What a remarkable answer he gives - proclaiming the dignity and divine origin of man!]
Entry 2760
[At least three Helens, all working at the same time, are indicated by the margin-title Miss Helen, Madam Helen, and Mother Helen. The original Helen must have had quite a reputation. Was this original the Helen of the Seven Sisters (2736, p.745 and Index)? Was Helen actually the Seven Sisters - one woman playing seven parts?] No, sir, they are not supposed to be hoodoos. They supposed to be God-sent people - so they tell the people, but they do's hoodoo work.
(Who are these people from Algiers who have altars and candles in the room?)
Well, those are what you call hoodoo spirituals. They are supposed to do whatever you want them to do with prayers, and like if your wife is gone, or like if you are gone. Yes, sir. I brought a fellow to one of them here that had earthworms in his body:
(Well, give the whole story about the whole thing.)
This fellow came to me. I was back on a street right here in town called Magnolia Street. He came to me - say a woman had fixed him up in Mississippi. He say she took and cooked those earthworms and she made a salve out of them and she rubbed him and that caused him to have earthworms in his skin. Well, I told him, I say, "I don't know what to do for that for you, but I can bring you to Madam Helen." That is a fortuneteller lady over the river. [My informant, a doctor not accepting live-things-in-you cases (for such cases See pp.227-239), refers and personally takes his patient to a specialist, Madam Helen. I, the author, for a few minutes once enjoyed the exhalted rank of specialist - see p.279.]
(Is she still alive?)
She is still alive. Well, I brought this fellow over there to her and she told him that she couldn't do nothing for him, in nine days [magic delay] to come back. Well, he say, he told her he was suffering pretty bad and he couldn't sleep because things were creeping in his skin at night, so she told him to come back in nine days. Well, he made it his business to come back in nine days, and after he went back in nine days why she took and she rubbed him with dead man dust. When she rubbed him with dead man dust and gave him nine drops of blood with sweet oil - sheep blood. She keeps lots of sheep, snakes and everything in her house. She gave him nine drops of sheep blood and she rubbed him with this dead man dust. There is a lot of places over the river there where they cremate the bodies over there. She got bottles lined all up in her house, different dead peoples dust in it and she rubbed this man and gave him that blood and this man is a well man right now.
(When you went into that room, did she have an altar in that room?)
She had an altar. It had a lot of candles burning - black candles, blue candles, purple candles, white candles, amongst diff'rent pictures [of saints] she had.
(Was the room light or dark?)
One [reception room] was light, but the room where the candles was burning of those great heavy stockings. She had on about three or four skirts. She dressed something like a gypsy woman do. They call her Madam Helen. She is over in Algiers on Pelican and 26th.
(When you first came in what did she say to you?)
She said, "Come right in," she said, "I know what is the matter with you." She told this gentleman. "You [informant] stand right outside, mister, you can take a seat on the gallery. I know what this man come for." [See You Don't Have To Tell Me, p.316; and The Doctor Knew What She Came For, p.317.] She said [to patient], "Something's wrong with you. How long you been like that?" "Well, I've been like this about three years." She said, "Well, you won't be like that long if you get me $50." That is what she cured this man for - for $50. And the man is healthy, strong and got a job. He works right here at the Public Service Gas right now and he hadn't did a lick of work for three years.[ New Orleans, La., (809), 1138:1.]
Entry 2761
Madam Helen learned me that. I worked for her in Algiers. Well, she was a two-headed lady, see. Well, so many peoples coming to her backwards and forwards, I used to go in and peek and look and see what she be doing: Well, that's how I'd get to learn - to knows all of these things. See. Course, poor soul, she'd dead, but she was a crack shot. I guess you have heard talk of her.
(How long has she been dead?)
She been dead now going on three years. Yes. But she had a place - great many colored go there, you know, they'd dance and carry on and everything. Well, she had a big house. She had snakes [see later]. She had any kind of animal you wanted to see around her house. If you was hurt or anything by any kind of ani- mal and went to her to cure you, she would have that animal dust or grease or something to give you to cure you.
(What was your work over there?)
My work was housework.
(Just housework?)
Yes.
(You didn't have anything to do with the customers then?)
No, I didn't have anything to do with the customers. But if they - if the customers would come, and rang the doorbell, I would answer the doorbell and let 'em in. But they'd have their room to sit down in. All I'd do, just go round and ring her bell and have another girl - for a white girl to come and receive 'em girls, if it was a lady, if it was a gentleman - whoever would come to see her.
(Was Madam Helen a white woman?)
Yes, sir, she was a white woman - white lady.
(I see, I see.)
She was a crackerjack.
(She received both the colored and white people?)
Both the colored and white people, but she had her days picked for the white. She had, I think on Thursday, Wednesday, something like, for the white. Now, on a Friday, that would be especially for the colored and Mondays - that would be their days. She would work four days and that was all. And iffen you was badly hurt, well, you could come and she would keep you there with her. Now, if you'd be colored, well, I'd 'tend to you like in a patient. I'd 'tend to you in the bed 'cause she had to keep you there to doctor on you anything herself. Well, I'd 'tend to you myself and I'd bring your dinner and your breakfast or empty your slop and keep your room clean, you see.
(I see, if you were what?)
If you was colored, you know, well, I had to do that 'cause I was colored, see. But the whites she'd - well, the white people - well, she had a white lady 'tending to that, see. But the white lady was over me. See. See, I was under. Madam Helen, she was my boss, but she never did pay me - 'twas the white girl paid me all the time. See. (Did Madam Helen dress in any particular way, or have an altar in her house or anything of that sort?) Madam Helen, yes sir, she had an altar. She had a great big altar in her house. See. (When a person came there, what sort of ceremony did they go through? Suppose I went over there, what would she do? What would happen? Just what would be the procedure?) When you go there, you ring the doorbell and they ask you who you want to see. You say you want to see the Doctor Lady. When you get inside, this white girl will come to you and ask you if you want to see Madam Helen. You say, "Yes." She say, "All right - No. 2." And she'll ring that number. Well, that's just like there be two of you, she'll ring that number - No. 2. Well, Madam Helen, she'll tell the girl to bring you in. See, you'll never see her till you come in where she at. See.
(And she'll be in this room where the altar is?)
She'll be in the room where the altar and all this mess be all round her - just all round the floor.
(Loose or in bottles or what?)
All around there - just like - just like you walk on the floor or something - there's nothing but them old snakes all around there and they won't harm you or nothing, and they'd be all around there. [For the use of snakes by professional workers, see margin-title Snake, Pp.66-73.] And she'd be setting down right in front of the altar - just there waiting for you to come in.
(She sat in front of the altar?)
Yes.
(Was she dressed in any special way?)
She was dressed just like - not in - just like there something in danger, she'd have a black gown on with a white - you know them crucifix and thing that be hanging around - you know what them priests have around them. Well, she'd have it like that, hanging around there, and wore a white cap. She didn't never did keep her hair no longer than right around here like that.
(That was for danger, you say?)
Yes, that was for danger - like if a person come in there hurt bad, well, she'd be dressed [in the appropriate color] before you get there. She'd know you were coming. (Well, now, what was a love affair? If you wanted to bring your husband back, how would she dress for that?) Well, she'd be all in blue. Just like a person - just like [the author], if you'd know you were coming there, she'd know you were coming - just like you'd say, "Well, tomorrow morning I'm going to get up and I'm going to see Madam Helen." Well, the next morning, she going to get up and she going to be fixed for when you come there. She going to tell you, she say, "Well, I know you was coming. Cause I have went right there and listen at her talk and I hear her myself. She say, "I know you was coming. You see, I got ready for you." you." say, "Yes, ma'm." [For doctor's foreknowledge of patient, see Consultation Tech- nique, pp.307-318.] (She dressed for each person. Well, how did she know that person was coming there to see her?) That's what I couldn't understand - how she know. She she really would know. And if she was living right now, I could tell you right now, you could ring her up and tell her you coming - you want to know her name or something, you know - just tell her you was a doctor or something and she'll tell - say, "Yes, well, you come over." [See Index for Doctor, author called a.] And you say, "Well, I'll be over day after tomorrow." And you say, now you say to yourself, 'I'm going there tomorrow." And she'll tell you, she say, "No, you coming here to- morrow - I know when you coming, I'll be ready for you." Now, how she knowed, I don't know.
(Did she wear any other color gowns?)
She didn't have nothing but purple gowns - purple gowns and black gowns - purple cap, black cap - and a blue gown with a blue cap. That's all I ever pressed for her.
(Did she ever have black ones?)
Black, I'm done told you - black and purple.
(Did she ever wear white?)
No, she never did wore white, I never did seen wear no white - always just be them three different colors.
(Now, this altar. Well, did she have candles burning on that altar or what?)
She had lights - all kinds of lights - red light, green light.
(All right on this altar?)
Yes, sir. (Well, if a person came in, did a person ever burn any of those lights or any- thing? What did they do when they first came in? Into this room now? I'm going in there now. I come in and she's sitting there in front of the altar. In a chair?) Yes, sir, got a big old chair - one of them round chairs.
(What would be the first thing that would happen to me then?)
Well, when you walk in there, you bow to her - you bow to her and you fall on your knees. And just like if you - you know, you come to see her - you fall on your knees. [See the Rev. Mr. Young's evidence for falling on knees before Prof. Frank, p.129.] And you turn and you light - you'll pick - you'll choose a candle that you wanta light. And you'll light it and she'll turn around and she'll look and see what color you be lighting and see if you are right; and if you wrong, she say, "Oh, no, don't light this one; light this one." And when you light that one, she'll turn around and set you down there. Well, the white girl will have to get out too; you see, there just be her and you in there then. See. Well, she'll work on you till eleven o'clock - whatever time she gotta work on you - till time for your time up. Well, round nine-thirty she be working - from nine- thirty till eleven in the day. Well, after eleven, she stop till two, cause she have her lunch and she take her nap. After two o'clock, well, you can [go] over there about three o'clock until seven at night, and then she'll stop until the next day. That's the way she would work. (Well, did you ever see what was going on after a person knelt? And what happened? Did she ask them what was wrong with them?) Well, one time I have went there and peeked and after that I was scared to stay, cause she had a snake wrapped around the lady's neck [see Snake in Index], you know, she had a snake wrapped around. The snake went around there and he come round thisaway and things and it just looked like to me that he was going to kill me cause I went and peeped and things. Well, she fussed at me cause she knowed it - I got scared and I run through the hall, that why she know I was through there. And that snake would just crawl all over that woman. And where the misery was at, that snake stopped right there and he just coiled up there. That's why she talked to it, she say, "All right, now, get down." To the snake, and the snake, well, it just wabble on over. Then she turn around and she got some kind of stuff and she do with her hand thisaway and thataway, all kind-of- Way and she started rubbing that lady. After that lady come out - that lady couldn't use her arm when she first went in. When she come out she could turn her arm thataway and hollering, "Thank God." thank God." But I know she did thank her for she sure did fuss, cause I was there peeking and I was scared of the snake. (Afraid. I understand. What did she usually charge? Have you any idea about what she charged?) Yes, sir. I had knew what she charged a couple of ladies. She have charged one lady I know of $25. She paid her debts for to cure her. Well, this lady was 'flicted all in her feets and things, she couldn't walk. She made her walk and she charged her $25, cash down, but I don't know how much altogether - how much it cost her. You know, for down, to start a'working on her. And another lady she say that she paid her $30 right down. Well, the lady that comes, her came from Lafayette, La. Never forget that lady. She done came from Lafayette, La., and paid her $30 just for to give her her speech back, and she made her get her talking back. She could talk but, you know, but she talk like this [imitates] - like that when she going to talk. Well, she fixed her up and got her tongue together and she gave her $30 cash down.
Entry 2762
Well, my wife.
(You what?)
[He's a little hesitant, nervous at first.]
I had went there over the river for my wife - to Miss Helen. [Long pause.]
(Yes?)
Yes, sir. My wife had left me. [Long pause.]
(Yes. All right.)
So, when she left me, I went over in Algiers to a lady by the name of Miss Helen.
(Miss Helen?)
Yes, Miss Helen.
(I see. All right.)
So she charged me $50. So ah paid her $25 down. So she called me in a room like this [my interviewing room at Patterson Hotel]. So she sat me down and so she made me take everything out of my pockets.
(How was the room - was it decorated or furnished with anything?)
It had candles. It had an altar - like an altar. It had candles.
(How many candles were there?)
They had about twenty diff'rent candles.
(Different?)
Some reds - some blue - black - green.
(Anything on the walls?)
Anything on the walls? No, they didn't have anything but some pictures on there. [Pictures of saints?]
(I see. Was she dressed in any special way? This Miss Helen?)
Yes, she was dressed at that time when she called me in. They told me to wait a minute she Was busy, but in a short while she dressed and she called me in. Well, she had a hat like a cap on, a silk cap, and a big robe - a robe on. You know, a robe.
(A robe?)
A robe, yes sir.
(Any special color - different colors?)
It was a purple robe.
(Purple robe?)
Yes, sir, with a big key - a chain with a big key like the oldtime door key hanging in front of her. (I see. Now, tell me when you went to visit her, just exactly what she told you - everything she told you to do, now. All right.) Well, when she told me, she say for me to go ahead and burn a candle.
(Wait a minute. What about your pockets? She told you about your pockets?)
Yes, sir, she told me to take everything out of my pockets and I done taken everything out. And I left some silver money in my pocket and when I left the silver money in my pocket, she say, "You ain't right, ' says, "ah cain't do any- thing for you 'cept you take everything out."
(Why did you keep that silver in your pocket?)
[I was trying to discover whether silver was for protection.]
I didn't want to come up with all my money.
(Oh, I see. I see.)
And so, after I take the silver money out, I lays it on the table. All right, she takes the other money out of the pocketbook and she lay it all down straight. She asked me, did I stay in town or did I stay out of town. I told her I was staying out of town. Then I was in Vicera. I was staying out of town at that time. She say, "Well, how much is your train fare?" I told her my train fare was $3.35 at that time.
(You were staying where?)
In Vicera.
(In Vicera, Louisiana. I see. All right.) [Nearest I can come to name.]
So she asked me what was the price of the train fare. So I told her the train fare. So she put the money aside and so, she said, "Well, I charge you $50." I say, "I haven't got $50." She say, "How near up to $50 you can come to?" I say, ''$25." She say, "Well, all right." And so she writ me out a receipt and when she writ me out a receipt she give me the receipt but it didn't have no price on it. So she tole me, "Don't send no money by the mail, just send it in a plain letter." So I sent her money just like she said. I sent $5.00 on the first pay- ment. She asked me how I got paid. I told her I got paid according to what I was doing - that I was picking, picking cotton. And so she said to me, "Well, all right." She said, "Don't send the money in no letter - registered letter. She say, "Send it just like - put it in there - a bill - you put it in there." She say, "I'll get it all right." So, I says, "All right." So, I written back to her to lets see if she got the money. So I didn't get my wife back at that time. See? But finally I got her back, but now I don't know if I got her back through that way or not. (What did she tell you to do? To do anything special? What did she tell you to do? Did she do anything?) Well, she told me to send a pictchure back.
(Her picture back.)
And she said I was crossed - see, the reason my wife left.
(Did she tell you how?)
She say how I was crossed. She say the woman had taken my thing and measured it and tied nine knots and put it around her waist. And say that there was some- thing buried - my pictchure was buried underneath the steps, beside the steps'. So she told me where I could find that pictchure. But I found that pictchure though.
(I see. Now, who took that measure? Your wife or some other woman?)
The wife takes it - it's supposed to be my wife what taken the measure of it on the cord. See. Nine knots they put in it. (Now, this woman Madam Helen, she didn't do anything - give you any treatment or anything when you were in her room did she?) No, she give me some powder.
(What did she call that?)
It's luck powder.
(Iuck powder.) )
She give me some other stuff they call van-van. (Well, what did she tell you? How to handle those or anything? What you were to do with them?) She say that when I pass by the house I throw it - throw it over my shoulder. And she give me another thing by the name of John the Conker root. She told me to chew that, see. And she give me another oil to keep and rub, see. She say nobody could hurt me after that.
(I see. What kind of oil was that?)
That was a green looking oil.
(It had no name?)
No name.
(I see. And your wife finally came back?)
She finally came back.
Entry 2763
Well, now, I tell you about the hair. A person takes some of your hair and cut it out of your head. I know a man did me that - that's the reason I tell you so good about it. My husband was laying and I was laying down in the bed and I was asleep - laying down on my back. He couldn't find my scissors, he got up and got the case knife. I heard something going - saw - saw - saw - you know, and I woke up like that. He was setting up in the bed - had my hair sawing a piece of it, got it out. So I went to the hair-dresser and she said, "What is your hair doing cut out." I said, "My hair ain't cut out my head." She missed it, and she say, "Yes, it is." I say, "Oh, Lord, I don't remember cutting my hair out for nobody." I say, "Gee, I'm going to watch my husband tonight when he come." He was working in the swamp and when he take a bath that night, I goes in his clothes and I look and he had a plat of my hair in his pocket. I said, "What you going to do with that hair?" He say, "I cut this here, Daisy, ' he call me Daisy, "to keep you with me 'cause I love you" - to keep me from going away from him. A Egyptian woman told me - I went to her - she say, "You suffering with your head." I say, "Yes." She say, "Some man cut your hair out your head and he dead." [See margin-title If Evildoer Dies Spell Incurable, p.396.] I say, "Yes, what did he do with it?" She say, "He take it to a tree in the woods and he bore a hole in that tree," and she say, "while he may - he put that hair in the tree," she say, "and then he closed it." That what the Egyptian woman told me. I say, "Well, what you think he want to do that for?" She told me, she say, "He didn't Want to kill you, but he wanted you to be crazy about him - cause that would make you crazy, make you follow him everywhere." Because he wanted me to go to that [camp something?] and he working there - and he wanted me to go and I didn't go. She say, "Well, you go on with him." So, well, my husband he got - he put my hair in the tree. He bore towards the sunrise. He got on the side of the sunrise and he dug the hole and she told me how to go there to get that hair. I went there right away and just like she told me, it was true - my hair absolutely Was there. I went and I take a knife and I dug the plug out. And my hair had done growed long and I taken it out and it cold-like. And I say [to myself], "Well, I declare." I say, "I never did dream about any hoodoo or nothing like that. I said [to myself], "Why she told me." I went to the hoodoo woman 'over the river" - she's dead now. She say, "Don't let no hoodoo and no fortuneteller or none 'em son-of-bitch tell you that you are fixed. You're not fixed," she say, "it's your blood cause you suffer with your head."
(Who told you that?)
Miss Helen - that was a hoodoo woman told me that. She say, "I could fool you out of money just like the rest of 'em fool you out of it," she say, "but there ain't anything ailin' you but your head." Well, that's just what the Egyptian woman had done tole me [that I was fixed]. Well, I was on two opinions. I didn't know 'aht to do. The Egyptian Woman had told me about my hair and Miss Helen done told me it was the blood. Well, I got operated on. That didn't do no good and I said it must be true what the Egyptian woman say. And I go - what the Egyptian woman told me - and I goes and that's where I found my hair was in the tree. And I say to my husband, "Well, what you want do with my hair?" He say, "Oh, I love you so much," he say, "and I don't want you to have nobody else but me and that's the only thing I'se wantin'." I say, "Well, listen."
(Did your husband die after that, then?)
Ohyeah, he got drownded.
(I see.)
He was working, he got drownded - he fell overboard, he got drowned. After I'd taken [found] that [first] piece, he cut another piece and he got drownded with the piece - that piece in his pocket. Because when they caught him [his body with a grappling hook] he was just so bad, they had to bury him with every- thing on 'em, you know, and that's why my hair is in the graveyard.
(He was so bad what?)
It did up - the fishes and things had did him so bad, you know.
(Oh, I see.)
Yeah, they had did him up so bad, so that's why they had to bury him with his pockets - with all his clothes what he had on, his working clothes. So that's.
(And he still had some of your hair? He didn't put it in a tree?)
Yeah, he still had it. And I went to hoodoos and all. I went to all. I have been to a lot of them and they tell me - some would say I was sick and [some would say]. [Egyptian woman is a fortuneteller wearing large earrings and sometimes a head covering; usually a Negro, occasionally a white woman, rarely a gypsy. Along the Mississippi River a drowned body is ''dragged for with grappling hook. For folk- lore methods to recover the body, see FACI,2ed., Nos. 15127-15136, pp.696-697.]
Entry 2764
Well, my wife, she was what you call goofer dust. [For Goofer Dust, see pp.222-227.] It was put down on the step for her. In the morning she used to have to go to work very early, you know. And in the morning she come out be- fore leaving-time, come out to clean up the step - didn't have any idea that any- one was harming her, was out to harm her. She stepped in some stuff - it was very white. And that night she came home and she said - that evening late she kind of got a little ailing in her head, you know, hurting. Didn't pay.much attention to it. Well, probably for a week or so later she didn't pay any atten- tion and finally it begin to swell on her. It swell and she went to the doctor and the doctor never could reach her sickness in no way. Well, she was talking to an old lady. Well, this old lady is kinda two-head, a two-headed woman. So she told her, she said, "Daughter, you're hurt." She said, "Your leg is not infected in no way; you never stepped on nuthin or caused a bruise to have this swelling, or something like that." She say, "I want you to go to somebody that can do you some good." She didn't tell her to come to her. So she sent her across the river to a woman by the name of Miss Helen.
(Miss Helen?)
Madam Helen.
(Madam Helen. All right.)
She sent her over there and she goes over there, and the minute she got in there, the woman didn't asked her her name or nuthin, she told her just what she came in there for. She told her, say, "You're hurt." She says, "There's a woman wants your husband," she say, "and she figure by hurting you in some way like that that he'll go off and leave you because you are not able to work." You know. [The husband is telling this.] Well, the woman she told her, she say, "Now, I can take care of you." She say, "I'll charge you $20," she say, ''$20 and I'll put you sound and well again." She say, "And if you want to, I can put it across back on the people." Well, she say, "No, all I want to do is get my- self straight," she say, "I don't have to worry about her." So, I taking her back over there - it was every Wednesday she had to go there. Every Wednesday she had to go there 'fore nine o'clock in the morning - 'fore nine o'clock. Well now, she had a dominic hand. You know what is a dominic hand?
[I did know, though there is momentary confusion here.]
(A hand?)
A dominic - dominic hand.
(A dominic hand?)
[I evidently thought he was talking about a hand made from a domino.]
Yes, kind of like a checker - black and white.
(All right.)
[I knew what he was talking about.]
Sells it. It's a dominic hand. She took this hand. She didn't ring it like some people ring it; she just pops his neck.
(She broke his neck.) [I am repeating his his.]
[At this point my transcriber knew what informant was talking about and over every preceding word hand typed the word henl The word hen was often pronounced han or han or something else. When people were closer to country life than they are today, the word dominic was fairly common. A variation of the word appears in the following couplet: "Dominicker [speckled] sky; storm close by" - FACI, 1st ed.. 1935, No. 540, p.21. I guestion the preceding word 'sells in the text: "Sells it. It's a dominic hand [hen]." As soon as hand is replaced by hen, the word sells is nonsense. The word should be spelds [= splits from Scotland] - see one of the remedies under margin-title Zippy Tull. My informant rightly feeling that I would not understand the word spelds, changes it to pops.]
(She broke his neck.)
Popped it, yeah. She popped his neck and she catches this blood - she holds the chicken up like that [demonstrates] and let the blood drip. She let the blood drip into a little cup-like. And she takes this blood and she puts to it sulphur - it's yellow, sulphur, and some molasses and mixes 'em, turns it into a salve-like. It turns into a salve and she takes this leg and she strokes this leg down with that. Every Wednesday she do that, she stroke this leg down. She don't kill the hen every Wednesday, though. She make enough salve from that to apply. We didn't have to go but for nine Wednesday - it was nine Wednesdays she had to go. And for nine mornings what she had to do - get up every morning be- fore the sun rise, and get her some running water and bathe this leg. She bathed this leg down and after bathing this leg down, then she take a complete bath in this household ammonia and saltpeter. See. This is supposed to take the condi- tion off of her. See? And walk to the east and take a glass of water, make the sign of the cross and throw it over her left shoulder and walk away. Well, she did that for [nine mornings].
(Did she do that before she went to see Madam Helen?)
No, that was when she went to her. She told her what to do.
(No, but she did that each time just before she went over to see Madam Helen?)
Yes, she had to do that before she go there - every morning, see.
(Oh, she did that every morning?)
Yeah, every morning she do that, for nine mornings straight, but she still had to go over there nine mornings. See? That was to help to take this condition off of her. See? And after she did that for nine mornings, well, she stopped, but she continued to take this bath. See, she warned her and told her forever to take this bath because if some more harm was to come to her and if she would take this saltpeter and household ammonia and bathe herself in it, and some running water, that no evil could come to her. You understand? It would guard her - it would be some kind of a safeguard to her. Saltpeter is supposed to have, be pro- tective for all such lines of hoodooism.
(And you wife got well?)
Yes, sir, she's well and working today:
(I see. Now, what your wife got hurt with. Was it goofer dust?)
Goofer dust, yeah.
(What's that?) [See, Goofer dust, pp.222-227, and Index.]
That's a hoodoo - it's a powder. You call it goofer dust. They take it - they puts it down and you're supposed to walk on it and if you walk on it, and it get on you, it will work through the sole of your shoe and it will commence to swelling. And it will make you drag, sick - sick, you know, sick with your leg - just cause it to swell and pain.
Entry 2765
[The preceding informant, No. 820, continues with another account of Madam Helen.] I had a friend of mine, he went over to this same woman - Madam Helen. And she claimed that this woman had 'im tied up so that he couldn't get hisself right to do with no other woman. She told him, "Well," she say, "I can fix you up." She told him, she say, "Look, you go home and you get your wife and you play with her." She say, "You be playing with her and you feel around her waist and if she gets anyways suspicion, just continue on playing but never go right on to the spot. You finally," she say, "you run you' hand around until you find it, and you take and you break it off of her."
(That string?)
Yeah. "Break that string off of her, '' she say, "and bring me that string." She say, "And when you bring me that string," she say, "after you bring me that string, I can take that string and I can work her in a Way that she'll take and throw that stuff out." Well, this string has got her sweat on it - her perspiration, you see. Well, he takes that string off and he takes the string over to Madam Helen, and he brought it over to Madam Helen and exactly what she did with it, I couldn't say what she did with it. But anyhow, this woman when he came back.
(She kept the string?)
She kept the string.
(You don't know what she did with the string?)
What she did with the string, I don't know.
(What did she tell him to do?)
She told him to go home and before she say anything to him to bleed her head. [To draw blood is a well-known device against witches - see Nos. 485-487, p.148, and Index.]
(I see, her forehead.)
Yeah, bleed her.
(Yes, get some blood from her head, draw some blood.)
Yeah. And if he bleed her, it's no more harn can come to him. And he come home, and no sooner 'n he got in the house - he was sneaking in the house before she could see him - bopped her on the head and cut it. He cut it and he was all right after that.
Entry 2766
Ah'd taken sick with the child, you know, before I left town. So I went to my house and ah stayed there three months. So I came back and when I came back, I just, you know, something just run all over me. You know, like a chicken - like a chicken when you pick it and you fix it - you singe it - with all them pimples - come up on it where you pull those feathers out. Well, you see my flesh all over was just like that. It was all round my neck and every- where was just like that. And so I just stayed sick and stayed sick - had doc- tors and doctors and doctors and doctors. So my husband told me, say, "Well, it just don't look like you goin' to ever get well." But still I didn't give up - still I didn't give up. I told him, I said, "Well, I just strictly believe that I gotta have an operation." He says, "Well, make it up in you' mind and go on a'get it." So the doctor come to me and told me I'd have to have an operation. So they rang up the ambulance for me. Ambulance came and ah got ready to get in the ambulance. So they took me on to the hospital and they examined me and they said I was too weak to take an opera- tion. Brought me back home. And so he said, "Well, you go next week." So my cousin come and she told me, she says, "Her sickness is not natch'l. Suppose you go and see about her - go and see somebody about her and question her." So he went and got a fortunetelling man - he didn't believe in nothing like that - went and got a fortuneteller man. And he come there and told him, "Your house is dressed." Says, "She left from here and went away [see preceding 3 months] and somebody done got de key and went in her house - got the key and unlocked the door and went in the house. Under the steps is dressed and all over. The back door and front door and all in the house is dressed." He didn't believe that. He says, "I don't believe it." So he talked with me about it and I didn't believe it. So, another one of my cousins come and told me and say, "Now, you must believe things like this because it's true." And she went and got de Bible and showed me, you know, where it says witchcraft, you know, and all like that in the Bible. [For some of Biblical sources, see my comment on p.361.] So, ah told him, ah said "Now, you go and see somebody, go and see somebody, [even] if you don't believe [in] him, go see somebody." And so he did. Him and my sister and another young man went, and they went to a lady called Madam Helen. She told him, she even as much as told him about my mother [in New Orleans]. She told him when I left from him and he had ordered a hundred and some dollars worth of furniture. She told him when he got dat and the date of the month, said, "Your wife has been down and this has been working on her for about eight months and - as clean as your hand. And it was true, too. Nobody ever went down and told her about it. She said, "It's a cup right under the left side - what's called the north corner of your steps, under the back and front." [My informant may not realize it but she uses unusual symbolism here. The outside doorsteps is a threshold altar! A person facing the house and standing in front of the steps is before an altar. To speak liturgically, he is looking "east and "the left side of the steps is "the north corner or "north end of the altar.] She said, "You go there and dig that cup up and if you - these people, if you want 'em to wander away, you bring it to me and I'll fasten it up. I'll put this junk in a bottle or a [glass] jar and let you go throw it in a running stream, if you want 'em to wander away. If you don't, just take it and fill it all full of [Red] Devil Lye." There was hair in there and lots of something look like blood, and nails and hair and garments, you know, pieces of step-ins or something - look like pieces of my underclothes, you know, was all in there. And there was needles in there, in the two cups underneath my steps back and front. And so she told, said, "Now, you go back and dig that up. When you dig that up, bring it to me and what you want did about it, I'll do it." And said, "Tell her to come." Well, ah was so weak. Ah was just so weak ah wasn't hardly able to stand up, and just did not want to leave that house. She said, "And move out dat house just as quick as you can." I just didn't want to, they just had to pull me out of there. And I just couldn't hardly walk, I was so weak. I went to her and she told me what was the matter with me. And she said, "Now, I don't want you to go back in that house. Never go back in that house no more." And I didn't go back in that house.
Entry 2767
(Is that Ida - Ida Murray?) [I had interviewed her.]
No, Rosanna Murray.
(Rosanna Murray.)
Yeah.
(She's about the next best they have?) [Informant had previously said this.]
Yeah, the next best they got.
(Well, who's the best here now?)
Well, the best they got chere is Bradley,221 Roman Street.
(Bradley?)
Yeah.
(What about Mother Helen?)
Oh, well, under them spiritual people like that - of course, what we talking about now.
(Is something different?)
They've got to be borned again to get up to that class to work, you know. They can imagine certain things and can do - certain things would materialize through prayers, too. You know that. But to get real down to the work and say, "I'm going to do so and so," they don't know anything about that. I goes around to all of 'em - at least, they send for me for certain information. Now, where I'm living at there now, I'm there through what I know - living at [something street] and that supposed to be the top of this city, and that's spiritual busi- ness. She got a church there and while it be - none of the spirituals [egua] her]. And she got seventeen churches besides that one in Texas - Galveston.
(Who is this, Mother Helen?)
Mother Hyde.
(Mother Hyde?)
Hyde, yeah.
(She's the best of the spirituals?)
Oh, lawd, yes - she's the best they got in town. Well, she gets a lot of stuff - why people from - well, she's getting three or four-hundred letters a day.
Entry 2768
(Was that the time you were being hurt?) Yes, sir. (Well, tell me what happened? How did they hand it to you? And how was that cured? Tell me the whole experience - the whole story.) Well, you know, that I couldn't even - couldn't walk in here like that.
(Couldn't even do what?)
Couldn't walk in here like that.
(You couldn't walk in here. All right.)
But then one fellow who came down here [to Vicksburg] took me to a fellow called Johnson down there [to New Orleans].
(Where did he take you to?)
To New Orleans.
(To a fellow called Johnson?)
Yes, sir. And course he told me that I was crossed up like that.
(Well, what happened when you went in? What first happened when you went in?)
He just asked me if I want git rid of my misery, and everything like that. He didn't do a thing but just rubbed me. And of course then I had a misery in my head. And then he said a man must have hurt my eyes, and he tied it up and told me use them head bandages - placed a candle over me for nine mornings and read a Psalm, and said a prayer. But the prayer was - but what the prayer was I don't know. (Was that a woman you went down with [from Vicksburg to New Orleans] or was this woman at Johnson's house?) They was there - she was. One was a woman and one was a man.
(Oh, they were working together in the same house.)
You see, when I first went to see him, why he was setting out on de porch. Well, it wasn't no porch either, but it like a church and he was sitting out there on a little old balcony kind of.
(It appeared like what?)
It's just a big church and place.
(Oh, a church.)
And still he treats people and all like that, see. He took us and carried us on upstairs.
(Into a room?)
Yes, sir - in a private room.
(And what was in that room?)
Like - just like desks and different things like that, just chairs and desks.
(I see. And then what else did he do?)
He asked me what was my misery and how long had it been hurting me and when it first started, and how did it work and things like that. And I told him. He told me to stand up and come to him - walk to him. See, I couldn't - I couldn't walk right. He told me that somebody had throwed something for me and so he would rub me. He would rub me and have me turn all the way around and bowing over and walking and coming back to him like that.
(What did he rub you with?)
Sir? Jest his hand. He didn't put no oil or nothing on it - jest rubbing and saying something. Jest rubbing [she demonstrates].
(He rubbed down off your clothing.)
In my clothes - just rubbing me down like dat for a long time. Then he would tell me to press up while he would hold me, push on me right here like that. I would strain up like that. I done paid him and then went on off.
(And then after that? Then where did you go?)
Ah went to a rooming house.
(Where?)
Went to a rooming house. (Went to a rooming house. Where did you meet this woman? Where did you find her?) The lady? Oh, I went back down there the next morning.
(You went back to this woman the next morning.)
And he told me to come back. I was supposed to go back and take the final treatment. He told me if I didn't have that why I couldn't walk up straight any more. Everything have happen to me like that. So, he tell me I was going too much, says, "Women like dat." I didn't tell him about how my head hurt, I didn't consider it was worth-while, thought it was just ordinary or something like that. He told me to come back and see about my head. So I went back the next morning.
(You went back to this church the next morning.)
Went back the next morning where we - so he was telling her about it. She didn't carry on [rub her], but she carried me around and telled me to sit down before the table and she asked me how my head hurt and all that and this and everything like that. And I told her. She told me sit down and she would fix my head up. So she lit a candle and put it before my - kind of a yellow candle and placed my hands before it, aside the candle. She got her one and lighted it, and went to passing it over her head [demonstrates] and she was saying something or other. (When she passed it - how did she pass it over her head? Like this? [I demonstrate.] Around her head in a circle?) Yes, sir. [See margin-title later, Halo Sign.] And so I had stayed there that day. And had to go back nine days - nine mornings. (Nine mornings. She did that nine mornings, you say. She said before sun- rise?) Yes, sir. No, sir - any time between twelve o'clock - between sunset and one in the evening.
(Any time between twelve o'clock at night and sunrise in the morning?)
[My question confuse her but she now gives the proper answer; the well-known magic rite.] Ah don't know how. But she told me to always come - never come at twelve - come before twelve when the sun was still on a rise. (Oh, I see - when the sun was still going up. I see. And that was all she did - burn this candle on you?) Everything.
(And then when she finished that - after the nine days, then what happened?)
Hit was gone! Never seen it no more.
(I see. What did they charge you?)
$25.
(The both of them - S25 for both of them?)
No, that was $25 for my head. I paid the same thing for the hip part.
($25 apiece? Each for the hip and the head?)
Yes, sir.
Entry 2769
Well, sometime ah haven't got bread in mah han's, ah have set a light tuh St. Anthony an' ah pray tuh him an' ah gives him a light. Ah gives him a white light an' ah sets mah light at nine, twelve an' three tuh him. An' ah axe St. Anthony fo' bread an' ah keep prayin' fo' bread an' ah raps, an' he gives me a rap back. An' at de end of nine days mah way would be open. (Now, in this rapping. Do you rap just once each time you set that candle? Or just once during the day? Or just once altogether?) Ah raps when ah set the candle.
(Just once. And he raps just once. When would he answer?)
In de noon of de day. [St. Anthony answered my informant's rap by rapping back; but not all saints answer in the same manner, as we shall now learn.] St. Jude.
(St. Jude. What do they say about him )
Well, he's a good saint. Ah set lights to him. Now ah sets a green or either a yallah light to him, an' ah raps fo' St. Jude an' he would conquer yo' enemies. He would make de way smooth fo' yo' an' in all sickness he heals yo'. Ah set mah light at night or in de day fo' him an' ah raps, but now he sends me a light - lak a star appeahs in mah house. Anybody could see it.
(You say this light appears in the house someplace.)
[Light in many forms is probably considered the greatest manifestation of the spirit - see Spririt Light, p.43f., and for general folklore, FACI,2ed., Pp.761- 768.] Lak if yo' know dere name.
(This person you know has stolen something from you?)
Yeah, an' yo' call dat name, write dat name an' yo' set chew a St. Michael or a St. Peter candle, an' yo' rap, yo' see, an' each time yo' rap, yo' call his [thief's] name, an' he gon'a come. (He's going to come and tell you that he stole this article from you or bring it back?) Or either take de Bible an' put de key in de Bible. Yo' gotta take dat Bible an' dat key an' yo' put it in dere an' yo' say a sincere prayer - Our Father's Prayer, an' yo' take dat key an' yo' turn it all aroun' in dat Bible. An' yo' see yo' call de fellah's name dat took dat, dat key goin' move jes' lak dat. [The key itself will move.] Den it gon'a stop. In nine days dat party will come back. Ah would take me a candle an' light it. Jes' say dat dis wus mah saint, what- evah saint ah'm usin' - say it wus St. Espedee. An' ah calls his [the saint's] name an' ah would rap fo' him [the saint]. An' ah would call his name [husband's name], rap fo' him [husband]. An' den he's comin' home. Ef ah got any of his shoes, ah take an' turn it bottom upwards an' he's comin' home.
(You call your husband's name?)
Yes. [This woman is a professional hoodoo doctor with a little spiritual thrown in. Her husband, Peg-leg, did some work for me on my first trip to New Orleans, but she refused to see me - afraid until my second trip two years later. These four statements about rapping were taken from her long interview broken up years ago. More of her material probably appears in the text.]
Entry 2770
An' then der'e's somethin' else dat chew kin do if you wanta move 'em from dere - to make trouble fo' dem - is dis. You git their name, you under- stan', an' de lan'lord's name, an' you write it back- wards nine times. You understan' dat. (You write this person's name - that is in the house - you write his name backwards nine times. And you get the landlord's name and write his name backwards nine times.) On top. An' then you say, you do it this way, "Son-of-bitch, ah want chew tuh vacate" - whichevah way it is. You understan', you git very angry. You don't have the good spirit with you, you'd have the mean one with you. All right. Well, you do that nine times an' you git double-strength war watah - double- strength war watah you understan', an' you git wal-wal powder. [For War Water, see p.663.] You understan' dat. You git cayenne red peppah, an' you git black peppah, but it has tuh all be fresh. You git Epsom salts an' you git soda. An' den you put these ingrediments into a bottle, de amount dat chew kin git it into, an' remember wit dat yo're not pleased, lak you talkin' to me, listenin' an' shakin' - yo're very angry, you see. You want them tuh git out an' you tell 'em that they must, an' the whole while dat chure doin' that you concentrate wit that mean spirit that chew want them tuh git out. Then you mix the ingrediments to- gether an' you shake it an' you say the same thing an' as often as you shake it, an' you tell 'em, "You must go, you shall an' you must," an' you stomp, an' den you roll it [bottle] an' you put it down. You roll it down [under your foot]. Dat puts 'em undah yore feet, you see. An' if yo evah work wit lights, yo' work wit lights.
(What do you do with this bottle now?)
Yo' keep dis bottle, yo' understand. Yo' see, yo' shake it as often as yo' kin an' den yo' use lights if yo' want 'em tuh go quick, if yo' evah use lights. You wash yore han's. Dat's devil work you doin'. All right. You see, you understan'.
(Well, what do you do with that bottle then?)
Listen, if you kin git anywheres tuh throw it - you git chureself some rattle- snake dust. You know whut that is - rattlesnake dust. Graveyard dirt, you know whut dat is. An' you mix it in dat ingrediment, you understan', an' you sprinkle it with that cayenne peppah, an' at de same time you throw it, 'Son-of-bitch, yo must vacate." But throw it wit a mean spirit. An' if you kin git aroun', you keep it sprinkle. An' dat wal-wal powder is shure tuh make 'em move, as ah set in dis chair. Yo' see. (After you get all these things in this bottle, you throw the bottle at their house?) No, nol You don't throw that bottle at their house, you keep that bottle. No, nol You kin bury that bottle, if you wanta. Co'se it'll take a little time. You kin hasten it if yo've got a place dat chew kin burn dese lights. But be shure that chew don't burn the lights in yore home. You know dat's de devil, don't chew? You know each one of the ingrediment don't mean anything good. All right. Now, if you wanta use the light - if you would wanta use the light, you go to de graveyard. All right. You gits de graveyard dirt, a lump. Understan' dat. You gits de Epsom salts. Yo' gits de cayenne peppah. Yo' git the black peppah. You git the salt. Yo' understan' that. You git chureself St. Michael - yo' understan', his picture. An' de red lights. You write dere name de same way in puttin' dat down. You understan'. You use the nine lights, you know whut time tuh use it - at midnight, while de spirit is 'sleep, you ketch it, an' you do it for nine, an' then you repeats, you see, until it do. But it guaranteed tuh do it. See.
(You burn this thing in front of St. Michael's picture?)
Listen. Take St. Michael's picture an' you put it in de east corner an' call it, you understan'. An' you put chure light down but don't put it out underneath dere. He'll do yore work quicker, you understan'. An' yo'll keep him there an' yo'll burn it fo' twelve - you understan', every half hour. You see. An' you wanta draw him? All right. You git chew parchment papah. You under- stan' dat you please - you see, you want a sweet spirit [therefore you use parch- ment paper]. One, two, three (knocking). [Parenthesis is by transcriber because 3 knocks can be heard.j You call him. He'll come. He's lookin'. "Why did joo leave her? Whut did she do? Why don't chew come back?" [You knock for the spirit again.] One, two, three. He's lookin' agin, an' you tell him, "Now, ah Wants you James, tuh come back to me, Louella. James come back to Louella, James come back to Louella, James come back to Louella." Yo' continue an' yo' knock. Well now, you got his spirit to yo' into that house, fo' with papah yo' write on goin' dat way, yo' have goodness into you, an' while you writin' his name you tell him, "Ah want chew tuh come back to Louella. Ah want chew tuh come back to Louella. Ah want chew tuh come back to Louella." Whatevah name that is. See? Now, you git chew nine lumps of sugah - you know dat lump sugah. All right, you git chure money. All right, yo' git chure drawin' oil. All right, yo' git chure mind on him an' yo' git chew steel dust. You understan' dat. You git chew pink lights, cinnamon - you work wit pink. First you use yore lights. Dat is to make peace. Now, maybe he's all you have left in de worl'. Den, you understan', dat white [not pink] light is fo' peace. Den yo' use yore pink. Yo' understan'. Well, ah mostly use mine an' git results through de Sacred Heart of Jesus. He first united you together an' you use Him as a patron saint an' ask Him. Den you take St. Anthony an' you give him de brown lights, an' he brings him back. Den there's anothah remedy you wanta have. Co'se ah dunno if you would wanta give it tuh her. You know whut ah mean. You would like tuh keep it or you could give it to her, you see, tuh make money, because when dey git wise to yore reme- dies, yo cain't do anything. You git chew a choice apple, you understan' whut that is, an' you do de same thing. You know de remedies dat ah tole you into this, an' you put it into that apple, an' de same way yo'll dress that apple - you really dresses it. You kin git holy water an' you bless it wit chure Our Father ovah it. Den you wipe it [apple] with yore holy watah an' you cores dat apple an' you use the names an' you talk to him while yo're doin' it. Den yo' put the ingrediments - de same - you remembah de same ingrediments dat ah tole you dat chew do. An' you want him tuh reason with her in dis remedy an' you take nine raisins [because the English word raisin looks and sounds something like French word raison meaning reason]. You know whut that is, an' you put it into that. Well, you put that ingrediment in there - all de ingrediments dat ah told you to. An' you git chew first a white light, an' you light 'em into that. An' den you burn one pink light an' in burnin' it you put his name on each one of the pink lights an' hers on de top. Yo' first wipe it [apple] off undah yore faucet. Yo' don't know whut han' an' yo' don't know whut crossin' has been on it, an' yo wipe it dry an' yo' bless it wit chure holy watah. Den you take an' shet it up an' you stan' it up an' you wipe that off on a clean piece of papah, but you use parchment papah with their names. Yo' understan' that. An' yo' dress it - you dress it with that mind oil - dat's to keep his mind to 'em. An' dat dryin' oil, you put that on dere. You see, when you dressin' that mind oil, you put that steel dust - everything is tuh draw him. An' yo'll burn [one candle] one time into de apple. When that one light - that's the name on de light, it isn't lak ah told chew. Then you shet chure apple up, an' if it's de 23rd of that, you dress it every 23rd an' it don't bring him dere, he won't be brought back. Ah'm tellin' yo' remedies that ah used an' that have helped an' de lady dat recommend me, know that these things are really good because ah have been with her an' he'ped her in some things.
Entry 2771
I had a pants taken from me oncet. (You had a pair of pants taken from you.) Had a pants taken from me oncet, and so I went to a lady to find out what become of my pants. So she told me that it was a friend of mine had my trousers, you understand. So I asked her what could I do to redeem them. She told me to go back home and she tell me that she'll cut the card on him. She'll set candles burning, for worrying him back at home. But then she said that he had never had did away with 'em, so far; but the time which he'll bring 'em back, that he'll have 'em on. Well, I goes on home and so she cuts the cards on him and she sets the candle, and she sets a black candle. She write his name down on it and she takes a piece of yellow paper and she wraps it around there, and she takes another candle, another black candle, and just like you are closing a letter - you know, all the way around, just like the way you got that paper curled around the candle. And just about [demonstrates]. (She seals this paper around the candle by using the wax from the second black candle.) With the black candle and leaves it burning. When this - she say when this candle burns out - see, I had to go and buy the candle myself. She said, "You set that candle and when that candle burns out and the paper burns down - but put it in a tub." You know, just like a tub where it wouldn't burn nothing, you know, around it. She say,. "When it burn out, he'll be back with the pants. Well, I did that and it was about a night and a day before that candle burns. Well, that candle burns slow. But it was about a night and day when that candle burns down, he was right back at the house 'cause he was rooming at the apartment where I was at. And he had the trousers on. I asked him why he happened to take my pants.
(Well, when you went to see this woman, did you see her here in New Orleans?)
Yes. I saw her - she was living down on [something] Street.
(You went into the room to see her? What did she have in that room?)
Yes. Well, it was just a ordinary room, just like anybody would have where they sleep. But then she had another little room there - you went in that till [after] you goes to her [she accepts you], where she used the cards. She had cards in there, you know, and diff'rent things around there. All kinds of saints and different things like that, but what they was for I didn't know.
(How was she dressed?)
Well, she just - several times I went down there she was dressed diff'rent ways, just like anybody else would wear; but she had on a black cap you know, just like a skull cap you know. And she was very old. But she was a woman that she could [do things].
(Can you tell me her name?)
Miss Mo.
(Miss Moe? How do you spell it?)
M-o-r-e.
(Miss More - she's dead?)
Yes, died a year ago.
(In 1937. I see.)
Entry 2772
She tole me she had been kind of worried. She, you know, have a busi- ness - a cook shop, she had. An' it wasn't no real good business. She was doing this to help support her children and herself, and she tole me that she had a lotta competition. Dey was trying to make her go in [into the city arrangement] you know and she Was paying license [to someone] you know out in de suburbs, and of course de city men hadn't come out tuh her yet. Dey turn her up dat she hadn't paid her city license and she was just worried to death, she tole me. She went to see this fellah and while she was there she wanted some luck. She told him she wanted some luck and she wanted him tuh help her out on dis case - see whut he could do fo' her. So he tole her if she would give him three pieces of silver, which that [is] three fifty cents - er [or] a dollar and a half, that he would burn a candle. Now, he read cards fo' her and told her this: And in these cards she saw where it was three pieces of silver - de silver dollar mixed up in dere - [and he] fixed it out [interpreted] so she'd have to pay the three pieces of silver [to him], and he tole her that this man what was in the cards would come in at the time [soon] and speak to her. He say in the cards - he was reading the cards.
(She had to give him three pieces of silver - fifty-cent pieces.)
An' everything would come out all right. He guaranteed it, he told her, and she wouldn't have to pay dis heavy fine.
(How much was the fine?)
$10. An' dat dis man [in the cards] would come in [court] an' speak for her. And jest as she got in there, she had to wait till others paid and de others went off - and instead of closing her up like they had threatened to do, she didn't have all of her money - jest as it was her turn to come, this man, the policeman that served her de warrant, came in and while he was there an' she was telling about herself, he heard it. He came in and told her it was jest a little kitchen affair - was not a big display of it but if she could help her family. An' then he tole her to pay him $2.50 and then pay him a dollar a week or pay him a little bit along, he would be lenient towards her, an' she could open her a big shop if she wanted tuh, but he would give her that chance for the effort that she was trying to make fo' employment. An' of co'se she had all confidence in this man [hoodoo fortuneteller] because he told her that at ten 'clock when she reached this place that he would be burn- ing the candle.
(He would be burning this candle while she was in the courtroom?)
While she was in the courtroom. And he guarantee that this would happen. [I would not say the doctor actually burned the candle, but I am guessing that his psychic power knew the policeman "would be lenient towards her" in court - "a little along each week.]
(Did that happen here in town?)
Yes.
Entry 2773
[I made no special effort to collect material about Marie Laveau, the second, or the hoodoo dance. It was too late for either one and besides I am not a historian. There will probably be a little more material about both in the text somewhere.] Well, dat's a person will do yo' somethin' dat chew go - it sup- posed tuh be mean things when yo' go to a fo'k of de road. Dat supposed tuh be very mean but den dere ain't nuthin whut a mean person won't do at times. Well, yo' take yo' a aig an' yo' soak it in vinegah an' dis cayenne peppah, but chew put de names of de party on dat aig. Yo' understand, put de name of the party on that aig an' put it in a jar an' soak it in vinegah fo' nine days in dis peppah an' salt. An' den yo' goes tuh de fo'k of de road an' make yore wish, an' yo' dance an' ever'thing, an' break it, but nevah look back at it - jis' break it an' leave it dere.
(What will happen to that person then?)
He'll leave direct - won't be a long time leaving, leave town. Yo'll send him away.
(The way she explained it to you?)
Well, she tole me dat dere wus a woman by de name of Marie Baptiste. She had two daughters an' she liked fo' her daughters tuh outdress de girls down in de 7th Ward. Dat's whare ah wus bo'n in de 7th Ward. An' she sol' herself to de devil at twelve a'clock at night wit de fire of furnace - a furnace fire, yo know, at de fo'k of de road in de woods.
(What kind of a fire? A furnace? How'd she get the furnace out there?)
[I soon realized she was talking about a charcoal brazier, when her furnace becomes a hot pot.] Well, she brought it out dere. She had it out dere an' she sol' herself to him dat she could git anything she wanted so she could go in de sto's an' any- thing she take dey couldn't see her.
(What did she do when she got out there? Didn't she do anything?)
Well, dey had some kin' of a dance dey danced, de hoodoo dance - dey danced wit a'kinda meetin' lak. Dey danced an' dat's de way she sol' herself tuh de devil an' dey had de devil tuh git her away from de devil.
(Have you ever heard of that woman Marie Laveau?)
Yessuh, ah've heard of her.
(What have you ever heard said or told about her?)
Well, dere's so many things tole about her. Well, ah tell yo', her an' mah mothah used tuh be friends an' ah used tuh be in her house. Some of 'em claimed ah wus partly christened at her house, an' she done everything she could do. She used tuh use dem furnace an' fiah too, an' hot pots on her. Ah kin carry yo' tuh de same spot of ground where her house wus on - yessuh, St. Ann between Rampart an'Burgundy.
(She was pretty good wasn't she?)
Yessuh, she wus fine.
(Did they used to have those old hoodoo dances when you were a girl?)
Yessuh.
(What did they used to do?)
Dance in dey petticoat tail an' dey shimmy tail - dance.
(Did you ever hear of them dancing a person to death?)
No, ah nevah heard of that.
(They just had those dances for good-time dances?)
De good-time dance an' dey wus doin' dey work at de meantime, but dey wus doin' hoodoo work when dey used tuh dance. Plenty tuh eat an' plenty tuh drink, an' if it wus anything tuh harm, dey would have hearts - raw hearts an' dey would eat that.
(What kind of hearts?)
Beef hearts. (Can you tell me any particular whole story about any one particular thing that you used to do?) No, ah wus too young tuh remember.
(Does any of that go on today or has it all died out?)
Well, ah think it's all died out an' dere ain't nuthin of that much now. It's gone. It's mo' de spiritual whut's goin' on now. (All that ole-time stuff has all died out? Those dances and things of that sort?) Jis' de time dey has it at de ole lake every 24th day of June. Yo' know dat's St. John's day an' dat's mah day. At de lake [Pontchartrain].
(What would they do?)
De hoodoo dance. Dey dance an' dey has a meeting, an' anything dat dey would want tuh do, dey does it that day. If it's good or bad they does it that day. An' anybody could go out dere if dey would wanta go. [After she leaves, my contact man Edward and I talk, though a part of the opening conversation is unrecorded.] Dat her name non est.
(How do you spell that?)
Ah don' know.
(Is that her real name or just a?)
Jis' a nickname we give her. [If Edward actually used the words non est, they were something our assistant Mack, old-time taximan, had picked up in New Orleans.]
(She is supposed to be pretty good?)
Yes, she's a spiritualist.
(That woman that was just in here?)
Yes. End 1584. ["Algiers, La., Fri., Feb. 23, 1940 - 1584 - old woman - several things - Ph [[something looking like Phillip - probably name of person who brought her]]." Numbers Book 1558-1605. Almost anyone would have been described as giving "several things" after following 1583, Nahnee - see her long interview. I did not know that the next woman to walk through the door would be - DARK LADY - DARK GLASSES - DARK DEEDS - See her interview.]
Entry 2774
(Marie Laveau?)
Well, I don't know anything about her 'cause I was a child and I was in the country, but just the people say in the country, "I'm going to take you to Marie Laveau."
Entry 2775
[This material should have been indexed under following sub-subdivision CANDLES, but preceding margin-title requires its indexing here.]
(Sing? Sing that hoodoo dance?) Yes. (Well, what would they do?)
She would just be staying like that [demonstrates] (clapping hands and singing).
[Parenthesis by transcriber who hears the clapping and singing.]
They'd then start to dance. (Will you sing that over for me again without clapping. See if I can under- stand a little of it. Sing it over again without clapping.) (She sings again - in French?) [Parenthesis by transcriber who guesses "in French?"] [Here is my penciled comment at time I checked original transcription against cylinder - "Mostly Marie Madelaine comme ca."]
(They dance and sing that?)
Yeah.
(What else do they do? At that hoodoo dance?)
Well, they'd just be dancing and be carrying around big switches - just like you would be dancing on somebody. [For an account of switches, see my experience at Tyree Church, Maryland, described in Introduction.] Then they got the lights [candles] all burning.
(Anything else?)
Yeah, they got all the lights burning, then they dancing. Well, the next night they comes in again and then they has a supper, you see.
(Well now, tell me - describe the supper to me.)
And then they have these people's names all on every place - they got their name down on every place [written on the floor?] - just like here they would be singing, and then - well, still and all, then when they'd get out, they'll come back and they'll go to the hall again - like where they dance at. See, that's on Thursday nights and Friday nights, when they got a big meeting. And then they'll dance on them people's heads [names chalked on floor?], and you see on the next day will go there to that house and they'll have something what they had [made] and they'll throw it all around them people house. See, something like make out they's a friend to you. Well, then they'll come to your house and throw that and put you in the worst luck they can and there ain't no way [where] you can go. And they'll move you clean out of that community.
(Well, do they have those dances any more?)
Yeah, downtown they has them - downtown.
(Not as many as they used to have?)
No, not like they used to have. ["New Orleans, La., Mon., Mar. 14, 1938 - No. 834 - woman 55+ by Mack" - Numbers Book 823-884.] [New Orleans, La., (834), 1256:3.] [Candles - whose spiritual smoke penetrates the hidden corner and rides the four winds and five waves - cannot be contained in this small sub-subdivision, CANDLES. To understand something about them one must include the preceding and following sub-subdivisions, ALTARS and SAINTS, as well as a few INTERVIEWS later. The two fundamental aspects of candles in hoodoo are color and power.] [Color value comes from three sources: (1) a psychology as old as history - black = darkness and evil, red = blood and danger, white = light and goodness; (2) the saint's color - meaning the predominant color in the saint's costume on picture or statue; and (3) hoodoo dealer - whatever he says the color is good for. The latter also includes pamphlets or printed instructions about candles.] [Power we can understand if we remember that a candle is a magic helper - a hand or toby (pp.519-669) - the magic helper, of course, being a spirit. If you do not believe this, turn back and read or reread THE PRIVATE SHRINE (p.773).]
Entry 2776
If yo' were livin' heah in dis house an' someone wanted tuh make yo' leave without a cause, then they [a hoodoo] would git yo' tuh stay in dis house. Dis a true fact because - yo' want some Bible facts on it erzactly how it's done? De way yo' do, yo' git chew three of these gold candles, gold-colored candles, an' yo' burn dem gold-colored candles, burn three until yo' have burn nine. An' when yo' have burnt de nine, yo'll have perfect peace, because de Bible says dat dey'd burn candles upon candlesticks. [See my comment on Bible and candles, p.361.] But chew have de instrument whut chew burn dese candles in of gold, an' have de gold- colored candles. An' ah guarantee it'll bring peace an' satisfaction heah, an' de proof is by de Bible. No one kin move yo' out. [These are gilded candles. I found no golden candlestick or container of any kind in the following rites.]
Entry 2777
And jest like if you goin't to a job - If you want dis job, you kin jest burn dis white candle fo' success and make yore wish and it will favor yo Yo' know dey burned candles when Christ died. [The Rev. Mr. Young has already said something similiar, "We understand dat de candles represent something in the life of Christ possibly," see 2735, p.745, line 1.]
Entry 2778
Well, you burn a blue candle for success. You burn a white candle for prosperity and purity. You burn a green candle - it's de spiritual [spirituals or spiritual people] suppose to burn these green candles. You burn 'em three days and pray and fast. Dat's to go and heal de sick. Then the red candle is fo' victory - jes' lak ef yo' wanta overcome somethin', yo' burn dat so many days, see, nine days. And yo' put chure wishes up under dat candle, yo' know.
(How do you put them under the candle?)
Yo' write chure name, whatever yo' want done - yo' write it on a piece of paper, parchment paper and set it up under dere while it burns.
(What do you do about black candles?)
De black candles yo' burn 'em fo' death. Yo' burn 'em nine minutes. If yo' burn 'em fo' evil, yo' burn 'em nine minutes, so they say. Yo' burn fo' nine minutes at nine 'clock.
(Nine o'clock in the morning?)
Nine 'clock in de morning or nine 'clock at night.
(Do you have to do anything else with these besides burning them?)
They say they generally roll 'em in some kind of cayenne pepper or something.
[See later, Rolling Candles.]